Sorry about this question I posed here. I can't find a way to delete this one so I have asked the mods to do it for me.
I'll do more searching for my answer as I have been told to do.

 

I'll do more searching for my answer as I have been told to do.

This is confusing.

If a MOD told you that, then he/she should have cleaned out this thread.
If someone else told you that.......then maybe they should go pound sand.

I don't think the subject has been addressed in exactly this manner and it might be useful to have actual numbers in a single thead.
Just my opinion.

If the thread goes on, however, I think it should be specified that the numbers posted be actual manual calculations and NOT from the on-board computer readout.

 

In Vancouver BC I only buy Chevron gas and unfortunately only the high end 94 is offered with out it. All other pumps are labelled with may contain 10% ethanol. So with that in mind and the fact that the 94 is somewhere around $165.9/L I doubt I'll be doing that experiment. I already feel nuts for getting the 89 octane when I think 87 is our lowest. It's just something rubs me the wrong way with giving into the lowest grade, like I've admitted I don't care and my vehicle is not worth it.

 

It's just something rubs me the wrong way with giving into the lowest grade,

Yep. The oil companies have done a real good job with their marketing.

Gasoline "grades" means ONLY the octane rating; NOTHING more.
89 is ***NOT*** better in any respect other than octane......and what you are doing is a complete waste of money in a car that does not need the higher octane.

 

Why don't we get back on topic guys. The thread is about non ethanol fuel.:00000732: Would love to try it but hasn't been offered in my area in years.

 

wiki encyclopedia usually give good info. There is also some debate around a epa move to increase ethanol in fuel from 10% to 15% .

Fight over allowing 15% ethanol blend heats up with petition filed with U.S. Supreme Court

You have to keep in mind the main reason ethanol use in US gasoline was mandated was to reduce dependence on imported oil. Not to reduce pollution.

 

Doing a Google search at the top right yields many more results than the vBulletin forum search function. I use the Google one most of the time as the vBulletin search (either posts or threads) are not as helpful in my experience around here.

On topic: I have personally not seen any improvement in MPG on my particular engine (Elantra). I have 'noticed' that I got better performance and the car 'seems' to run better, but I have absolutely no way to back this up so take that with a grain of salt. I moved from a fuel that had 5% ethanol (Esso 89) to 0% ethanol (Esso 91).

As for the 15% ethanol possibility, my owners manual specifically states not not use more than 10% so I would watch for that.

 

In answer to the original question which got sidetracked somewhere along the way, I did try one tank of non-ethanol gas about two months ago.

I had read all the comments folks have made about increased mileage when using ethanol-free gasoline, and I expected to see some increase in MPG. This was not the case. I saw no increase. Furthermore, the ethanol-free gasoline was about 20 cents more per gallon (if I recall correctly). The original poster commented about trying more than one tankful because of the dilution caused by the remaining ethanol blend gasoline in the tank; however, given the price difference, I chose not to try another tank. The dilution would not have been significant. When I filled up, I had at most 2-3 gallons in the tank.

It seems logical to me that mileage would be improved when ethanol is eliminated. I am at a loss as to why it was not.

 

I did try one tank of non-ethanol gas about two months ago.
I saw no increase.

About 20 years ago, like you, I tried one tank of 100% gasoline(no 10% ethanol blends). Tho I thought I saw an increase in mpg, I didn't think it was worth the extra cost. Since that time, I developed years of accurate records of 10% ethanol blend usage in 3 separate automobiles. About 5 years ago, I re-tried 100% gasoline, since I did have accurate records spanning years of usage & could more positively compare. Initially, as before, 100% gasoline showed an increase in mpg, enough so, that I continued to use 100% gasoline. As the months & years of 100% gasoline usage stretched out, my calculated mpg for each car, took on their own accuracy, enough so, that each car had their own response. The 3 cars, had individual increases of 8%, 7% & 5% increase in mpg. Also, in all cars, engines were smoother, quieter & had a trace more low rpm torque, such that less downshifting was necessary to ascend hills. One of the cars, an old car, responded very well to the 100% gasoline. I had been tinkering with the idea of switching out to fuel injection to end its minor unevenness. But the 100% gasoline ended the unevenness & the car no longer needs fuel injection.

 

you need to save money to fill up back to back of a slightly more expensive fuel? yikes man

#firstworldproblems


stick to the normal stuff

 

I used to own a ford ranger that got worse mileage and idled rougher with E-10. Since then I have always used non ethanol gas in my vehicles. Stations are required by law here to identify pumps that have E-10. There is a 7/11 near my house that gives you a choice and charges about $.05 more per gallon for ethanol free.

 

Stations are required by law here to identify pumps that have E-10.

I think that you will find that is not exactly true.

Everywhere I have been has stickers that say: "This fuel MAY contain UP TO 10% Ethanol". So that means that it can be anywhere from 0% to 10%.

The specific rule might vary a tad bit by state however.

 

I found this link showing which state and city sells ethanol free gas.

Ethanol-free gas stations in the U.S. and Canada

In our area there is non that I am aware of.

Thx

 

Nothing here with no Ethanol, what would the benefit be anyway?

 

See post #11 above.

 

It's interesting. According to the website, the gas stations in El Paso with non-ethanol gasolines are the Walmarts and Sam's Clubs. I read a while back that the gasoline sold through them from Murphy USA was not high-quality gasoline. I pay a bit more but Shell is the only gas I put in my Santa Fe.

 

Hey guys. Sorry, I have been out of touch with the Internet for a few days. Looks like I started another one!!



A word of explanation. I’m still new here and like the other forums I use, have to learn to adjust to your rules. Not saying I am new to forums in general, just this one. The forum I have had a major interest in for years, shows I have made over 6000 posts and don’t remember ever having one locked up or causing so much concern over how many threads I started. It is the CMP forum. If you don’t know what that is, I invite you to do what ya’ll seem to love saying, “goggle it”, or “use a search engine”.



I mistook a member or two as being mods, since they were the leaders in chastising folks on opening new threads. My attempt to delete my original thread was not to end the discussing I started but felt I’d violate yet another rule by moving it to the “big” thread on mpg, tank size, range, etc. and still have this “error” of mine still open. I have never, at ANY of the forums I attend, had subject matter locked up or received comments that I should not start new threads on subjects already talked about like I have here. Other forums don’t seem to have a problem with anyone opening new threads.

May I assume that every subject we can possibly ask about or talk about on the 2013 Santa Fe about has just about been covered someplace here?

Be that as it may, my question on non-ethanol gas usage is focused primarily on the 2013 Santa Fe since it is what I drive. I would have liked to hear from guys/gals driving other models and years also but this IS the “DM Santa Fe 2013” forum. Don’t want to get anyone in trouble.


I am not talking about one tank but running several, at least two, tanks back to back and seeing what, if any, changes you see in mpg and performance, etc.

In my search I found little info on the subject mired in the “big” thread, on MPG, tank size, range, to answer my question. Maybe the info is there but it was taking a good bit of time poking around looking and I never found it. I’m old, time is important to me. So I started my own thread on this type of member “test” if you will.



If this is in violation of some sort, again, I am sorry to have caused heart burn among the members.
Sorry I was late to reply to questions about my comments. No harm intended to anyone.

 

I don't see where anyone said you shouldn't have started this thread.

I think you are grossly overreacting with this comment. Aren't you getting the discussion you wanted?
John

 

OK golfermack, you guys are right . It's me that is grossly over reacting. I'll bail out now. Thanks for your help getting me straighten out.

 

JRM2013...Good afternoon..

I`m guessing that you`re referring to me above.. so I have to respond...a few comments to clear the air:

* #1....Please re-read my post (#9 ) on the thread entitled...LOVE my Santa Fe Sport...

* #2....NOWHERE in that post did I suggest that you delete this one...In fact, I didn`t even know that you had started this one...

* #3....That post (#9 ), suggested that MPG discussion belonged in the MPG thread already started...that`s all that post suggested...(re-read it)..

* #4....In your post, quoted above, you suggest that folks on this Forum don`t like 'new threads'....I don`t understand why you would think, or say, such a thing...

I DO THINK that most members here (and the mods) do not like to see 'duplicate topic' threads...I repeat, 'Duplicate Topic' threads...

Lastly, I`m glad to see the comments coming in here about ethanol gas...nice thread...Have a great day....:beer:


'over & out'

 

LOL, come on Cheers. I have admitted the whole thing was my fault, said I was sorry, won't ever happen again, I won't start any post just reply to others and be a good boy.
Lighten up, you, and couple of others, have gone on more about what I have admitted to than adding anything to my original post on the subject. I think. Could be wrong.
I promise I won't add anything more to this thread other than I got my first tank of "real" gas today.

 

O.K.....:grouphug:......Done deal...

I really don`t have much to add to this thread (except I remember when it was 18 cents a gallon),... I`m here to get educated...that`s why I was glad to see it get started...:clap:

I went to that link posted on post #22 to see if there`s any in Delaware, but none listed...

We`re leaving on a trip tomorrow to Louisville,Ky., so I`ll be looking for a station that sells it...As others have said, takes more than one tank to get a feel for any difference...so maybe I`ll get lucky and find numerous stations...

Happy Trails..

 

yes i have put non ethanol gas into my car. the standard is 10%. there are a few stations here (shell i know for sure) that if you buy their top end fuel there is no ethanol in it.

i noticed no performance increase, at least nothing detectable by the butt dyno. if there is, its negligible.

however i did notice a slight increase in fuel economy as should be expected. however, it was not anywhere near the amount that you'd need to make it worthwhile to keep buying the stuff at the premium price it commands.

only time i buy premium now is when the station is out of regular and mid grade. then you get premium for the price of regular

 

Two more testimonies favoring 100% gasoline over 10% ethanol blends:

I definitely notice the difference in my little Hyundai when running the real stuff; smoother, slightly more power and better mileage. Just wish I was closer.

I just fueled up. I'm glad I found this site. My 2008 Cobalt runs so much better on the freeway. A lot more power and better mileage. Ethanol is BAD stuff.

 

Nice place to get 100% gasoline:
Kingsland Grocery, at 500 S Lee St, Kingsland Georgia is the place to fill up. Their prices on E-10 are competitive with those out on 95, but their ethanol free 89 octane is 2 cents less (yes-less) than their 87 octane regular E-10. Go figure. The manage said she was aware of the price difference but that's the way the company wants it. Now this place is a grocery store but they have a few tables where you can sit and enjoy a cold drink, soda to you Yanks , and a Klondike bar or other snack. The staff is friendly

 

Another testimonial for 100% gasoline:
Just like my long records comparing 100% gasoline & 10% ethanol blends, only their records show differences even greater than mine.
////////////////
Theoretically there should be a 3% loss of MPG when going from gasoline to 10% ethanol. I have recorded every tankful MPG for 115,000 miles. A few yrs ago our rural was required to add 10% ethanol (to buy corn belt votes), so I have 70,000 of MPG with real gasoline and 65,000 miles with 10% ethanol. ( Same driver, same driving pattern, modern state -of -art fuel inj 5.6L Nissan V8). By inspection (have not mathmatically averaged data) it looks like a change from 16.8 MPG to 15.2 MPG, or about >10% loss due to ethanol.

 

it looks like a change from 16.8 MPG to 15.2 MPG, or about >10% loss due to ethanol.

Well there IS one possible factor that you might have overlooked.

My past experience with a Maxima showed me that OCTANE makes a big difference. Mine would run OK on regular but got a big boost in performance AND fuel economy when using a higher octane fuel. The difference was truly amazing.

IF your E10 fuel is lower in octane, then engine may have adjusted and become less efficient in the process.

 

'nother testimonial(not mine) for 100% gasoline(ethanol-free) vs. 10% ethanol blends:
/////////////

Looking back at my fuel records, I have a few E10 tanks clocking in at 31 MPG , but most of them are in the 26-28 MPG range. My E0 tanks........ range from 28-36 MPG , with most of them in the 31-33 MPG range.

 

i get better gas mileage filling up at shell or chevron it seems instead of pilot, loves, quickmart, q, or Arco... tend to get three miles or better per gallon (not sure about the ethanol though but i would rather pay more at shell and get better mpg)

 

By Sebastian Blanco:
Posted Aug 31st 2010
Since last summer, Pure-gas.org has been compiling a list of stations that sell, surprise, "pure gas,".... Currently, Pure-gas lists 1,531 stations in the U.S. and Canada that don't mix corn with petrol.......
//////////
100% gasoline is being cut by 10% ethanol. 100% gasoline is so powerful, that most people, not using mathematics & carefully listening to their gasoline engines protest ethanol, aren't seeing the worthlessness of ethanol.
Presently, hundreds of thousands of drivers, who do see the worthlessness of ethanol, support 7000+ sources of 100% gasoline now listed at pure-gas.org, despite the continued hammering of the ethanol industry & the EPA's supposed easy steps to pollution control.

People who pay more for a product, who say it is superior, should be listened to with more care than people who buy products because they are cheap.

 

Not fanning the flames here but my manual says " Pump octane Rating of 87 (Research Octane Number 91) OR HIGHER".
Every car I have owned, with an exception or two, have given me better mpg with the middle grade gas. No matter what brand. I don't mess with checking 0 to 60 times so I don't know about more power. I have and do use the 89 octane now and in my 2010 SF V6. Both got me enough difference in mpg that I will stay with it.
Just my .02.

 

A poll among members of a website, interested in gasoline availability:

Is blending ethanol (up to 10%) into gasoline (E10) a good idea?
Yes
18%
No
65%

 

The original objections to using ethanol in fuel was that it wrecked the seals in car fuel systems - that objection still holds true for owners of classic cars but some markets, eg Europe, are continuing to make a non-ethanol high octane fuel available, at a price, to protect these owners.

Car fuel systems have been suitable for using E7 for many years to permit the use of E5 in Europe although here the fuel companies could meet their overall % obligations by using E0 petrol/gasoline and E5 bio-diesel.

More recently, cars have been modified yet again to permit the use of E10 and in Europe we're now finding that all petrol/gasoline and diesel is E5 or higher - that's apart from the protection grade.

It should be remembered that ethanol has always been used to blend with refinery output to adjust the octane number and Henry Ford once said that ethanol is the fuel of the future!

 

The original objections to using ethanol in fuel was that it wrecked the seals in car fuel systems - that objection still holds true for owners of classic cars but some markets, eg Europe, are continuing to make a non-ethanol high octane fuel available, at a price, to protect these owners.

Car fuel systems have been suitable for using E7 for many years to permit the use of E5 in Europe although here the fuel companies could meet their overall % obligations by using E0 petrol/gasoline and E5 bio-diesel.

More recently, cars have been modified yet again to permit the use of E10 and in Europe we're now finding that all petrol/gasoline and diesel is E5 or higher - that's apart from the protection grade.

It should be remembered that ethanol has always been used to blend with refinery output to adjust the octane number and Henry Ford once said that ethanol is the fuel of the future!

There is a battle brewing in the U.S. for the future. EPA has approved E15 gas, and the government is contemplating a mandate that all gas be E15. It is for sale in some states, but it has not yet been widely accepted. Car makers are pushing back hard, claiming that it will damage engines, and most have gone on record stating that using E15 gas voids your warranty.

We'll see how this plays out.......