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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
This is how mine looked like after only 4,500 miles, and after using my walnut shell cleaner and soaking in carbon removal. Sure noticed a drastic change in performance and especially in fuel economy, but it still ran.

Couple of months ago, returned these four plugs to my dealer, never asked for a warranty replacement. Said they will look into it, so far nothing.

Could be yours are okay, contribute this to improper baking of that center ceramic insulator, should be at 2,700*F for 24 hours. Very porous and that carbon is burnt in solid.

Is conductive, on my high voltage tester, all four were breaking down at 3KV, but can't explain why it even started, but did run very poorly and no more 50 mpg on the freeway, more like 32.

To not cause a debate to what I put in there, after 5,500 miles, checked them, just as cleaned as the day I put them in there. Take this as something for you to look at. Not only this Limited, but my kid's Soul as well. She was ready to dump it for very poor performance, when it just needed good new plugs. This is two out of two, not statistically correct, but experience.

Another thing to check is the resistance between the terminal and the tip side of the plug, should be about 7K +/- 20%. Could have a dead open circuit with part of the spark being consumed by that extra gap between the resistor and center electrode. I gap at 25 mils, read someplace 45 mils! They have to be kidding.
 

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I seen some YURA come across part counter to go into a V6 that was getting service.. Not sure about them, maybe CHAMPION of Korean manufacturer,, felt bad for customer not receiving normal NGL like we normally have
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
So you took them out, cleaned them, and put them back in? Or did you go with another brand? I'm only at 1600 miles so I probably won't check mine for awhile, but then again 32mpg would be a good number for me.

50+ mpg is good for me on the highway, getting around 37 mph around town depending on the color of the traffic lights. But only on summer gas, don't even want to think about this winter crap.

Installed Autolite XP5702's, 18 bucks for a set of four including shipping. Are iridium, designed in the USA, but made in Mexico, have to see how this lasts with the new administration.

Worse victim of marginal or poor sparks is the catalytic converter augmented in more recent years by fuel injectors. PCV is the culprit here with all the blowby from the engine going past them. So besides keeping your plugs clean, also have to keep the engine clean, Seafoam works for me, a full can of it tossed in the gas tank every 4K miles.

1972 was the year we got stuck with the cat, never had a cat failure yet, knock on wood, always the first time. An after the fact emission control device.

I clean my plugs every 15K, twice, replace them at 45K, twice around the earth is enough for any plug. Fuel injectors, get pulled every 60K miles for a manual clean, could post the procedure in another thread.

Reason why I love a four cylinder in a FWD vehicle, an absolute pleasure, quick and easy as opposed to some V-6's and 8's, can be over a half a days job on these things.

Also love coil on plugs, some use a module for this, one coil goes bad, have to replace the whole thing for $$$$. Easy to test with a gated bipolar transistor with a 50 V zener diode reverse polarity driven by a pulse generator. Expect using an adjustable spark gap tester to see at least a 3/8" spark. But this is with free air, on the huge tuberlance the plus see in the engine.
 

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Excellent post. Some food for thought. I'm at 6K miles, I'll check in another 9K and see how things look. But my mileage is on-point, if not a bit higher than expected, so mine are likely just fine. At least for now. Probably fine in the future, but.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
0.8 mm is not to bad, in English 31.5 mils, (mil = 0.001 inches), but since I have the equipment, 25 mils runs far better under turbulence conditions. This would be 0.64 mm.

These smaller engines are high revving, and when compared to other small engines, outboards, motorcycles, chain saws, gaps are in more of the 0.4 mm range. Somebody is not thinking.

In the old ignition point systems, a condenser, actually an oil filled high voltage capacitor was placed in series with the primary of the coil. This would resonant the coil and produce a series of sparks that would be a millisecond long! Can't do this with unipolar solid state, so only get one spark about a microsecond long. Could do with with a capacitive discharge system requiring a high voltage converter, bean counters won't here of it.

So your best bet is to use the smallest gap as possible and keep your spark plugs clean. That carbon, 5.5 pounds of this stuff in a 6 pound US gallon of gas builds up on that center electrode insulator that is conductive and shorts that high voltage back to ground.
 

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Gosh, guys. I've owned a 2011 MD with 32k, a 2013 MD with 72k, and now, an AD with 27k. Not only have I never removed a plug, I've never removed the engine cover.

Just realized, when adding it all up, that's 131,000+ miles between the three of them. Guess I've been getting my share of "seat time." Let son drive it around the block. One granddaughter drove it about 5 miles, and another granddaughter had a few laps in an empty parking lot. Other than that, and the occasional service tech on oil/filter changes, it's been my old wrinkly butt in the seats of those rides.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Gosh, guys. I've owned a 2011 MD with 32k, a 2013 MD with 72k, and now, an AD with 27k. Not only have I never removed a plug, I've never removed the engine cover.

Just realized, when adding it all up, that's 131,000+ miles between the three of them. Guess I've been getting my share of "seat time." Let son drive it around the block. One granddaughter drove it about 5 miles, and another granddaughter had a few laps in an empty parking lot. Other than that, and the occasional service tech on oil/filter changes, it's been my old wrinkly butt in the seats of those rides.
I like getting 50+ mpg, so keep my spark plugs and injectors clean, but this is if I hold it at 65 mph, if I push it at 77 like everybody else, drops to 46 mpg.

Regarding my Supra, the only driver so far, be darn if I would let my ex-wife or kids drive it, but they are all gone now. Would let my new sweetheart drive it, but she is afraid she may hurt it, but likes to ride in it.

But she sure likes driving the Limited, kind of call this her baby.
 

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I like getting 50+ mpg, so keep my spark plugs and injectors clean, but this is if I hold it at 65 mph, if I push it at 77 like everybody else, drops to 46 mpg.
Nick, running E10 or E0 up in the frozen tundra?
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Whoever came up with alcohol and gas does not mix didn't know they were talking about E10, a heterogeneous mixture. Ethanol is heavier than gas, and as such, will settle at the bottom of your fuel tank where the fuel pump picks it up first.

Should be a sign on your vehicle, shake it before driving. Same can happen at a gas station if not constantly mixed, can end up with not 87 octane, but with just 80, your car doesn't like this, and already experienced this a couple of times before. Instead of getting 37 mpg when I had no choice to use this stuff, more like 17 mpg. Had to drive home in 3rd gear at 40 mph to prevent detonation. Any faster, engine would knock like crazy.

I did not know at the time I was not suppose to put E10 in my Supra, but for awhile, this is all we could buy. Did over 700 bucks of damage to my fuel system that I repaired myself at internet prices, was quite angry at the time, also other small engines like snowmobiles, ATV's, lawn mowers, you name it. Mercury in Fond du Lac screamed about this, finally got ethanol free.

Have to sit down and explain this to me, Hyundai says okay to use E10, but not E15! Whats' the difference, is it that E10 will cause the same damage, but just take longer? Yet another consequence, the farmers around here can make more money selling corn rather than feeding it to cows, so the price of meat and dairy products skyrocketed, feeding this stuff to SUV's instead of us.

Use to tune my vehicles to burn 93 octane for better fuel economy and performance. Don't have to do this anymore, was replaced by a computer. Has an anti-knock sensor that really shortens your combustion cycle when you use this low octane stuff. So you end up with poorer fuel economy and performance. Ethanol is not a good idea and hope and pray you get a good mix.
 

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Nothing but the best, top tier, ethanol free, 91 octane is the highest up here.
We have 91 E0 here, as well. No denying the clean burning advantages, improved mpg's, etc. But I question (for me and my situation) the top tier pricing that comes with it vs MPG benefit.

You are absolutely right: When I join into the highway fracas of 75-80mph, it wouldn't really matter what was in the tank. The car stops using a straw to sip that tank of nectar. Opts, instead, to use the equivalency of a 5/8" garden hose. ;)

Still, at those speeds, I can pull mid-30's in fuel economy. That fits my style. Anymore, when I go somewhere farther then 15-20 miles, it's "pucker time." I want to get there in the relatively shortest amount of time possible.
 

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Whoever came up with alcohol and gas does not mix didn't know they were talking about E10, a heterogeneous mixture. Ethanol is heavier than gas, and as such, will settle at the bottom of your fuel tank where the fuel pump picks it up first.

Should be a sign on your vehicle, shake it before driving. Same can happen at a gas station if not constantly mixed, can end up with not 87 octane, but with just 80, your car doesn't like this, and already experienced this a couple of times before. Instead of getting 37 mpg when I had no choice to use this stuff, more like 17 mpg. Had to drive home in 3rd gear at 40 mph to prevent detonation. Any faster, engine would knock like crazy.

I did not know at the time I was not suppose to put E10 in my Supra, but for awhile, this is all we could buy. Did over 700 bucks of damage to my fuel system that I repaired myself at internet prices, was quite angry at the time, also other small engines like snowmobiles, ATV's, lawn mowers, you name it. Mercury in Fond du Lac screamed about this, finally got ethanol free.

Have to sit down and explain this to me, Hyundai says okay to use E10, but not E15! Whats' the difference, is it that E10 will cause the same damage, but just take longer? Yet another consequence, the farmers around here can make more money selling corn rather than feeding it to cows, so the price of meat and dairy products skyrocketed, feeding this stuff to SUV's instead of us.

Use to tune my vehicles to burn 93 octane for better fuel economy and performance. Don't have to do this anymore, was replaced by a computer. Has an anti-knock sensor that really shortens your combustion cycle when you use this low octane stuff. So you end up with poorer fuel economy and performance. Ethanol is not a good idea and hope and pray you get a good mix.
Shaken, not stirred?

 
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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
That pump/filter come out of your 1938 LaSalle? :grin2:
Closest car I had to a 38 LaSalle was this thing or one just like it, 37 Caddy Limo, picked it up in Lake Forest, Ill for 75 bucks with a V-16, but was made fun of in high school for driving a hearse. Don't give into peer pressure anymore. Don't believe they had ethanol back then.

Was a fun car to drive.
 

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Ethanol only drops out of suspension if it absorbs too much water, other wise you would never know it's in there. Been using E10 for the last 40 years here in Illinois and it is very difficult to find any E0. Closest is 40 miles away and $0.40 a gallon above the normal E10 blend. I've only had problems with E10 gas and water in my pressure washer which sits for a year at a time between uses. Some of the farmers who buy gas 500 gallons at a time get too much water as it sits for so long.

You can dope you E10 with a little water and the ethanol and water will drop right out leaving 100% gas for small engine use. Just get a octane rating above what you need as the ethanol is used as an octane booster.

And I love Denso Twin Tip iridium plugs.
 
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