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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
My wife was in need of a larger vehicle, so we turned to Columbia Acura/Hyundai in Cincinnati, where we have purchased our last 3 vehicles.

I am a meticulous vehicle maintainer - washes / waxes / oil changes. I'm the guy that cleans the door jambs and inside the fuel filler at every wash, and you can eat off the engine.

Our trade in vehicle was a 2008 Tiburon GT V6, tires with maybe 10k left, but otherwise flawless, and freshly detailed.

She selected the new Sonata, specifically the Turbo model after driving one. The dealership did not have any in a color combination she wanted, but offered to find one and have it for us the following day. They brought in a black on black 2011 Turbo SE from another dealership in Columbus, roughly a 120 mile drive down the expressway, and offered us $12,500 (initially only $11,000) for the Tiburon.

Someone drove the car from Columbus down to Cincinnati, and obviously, it was pulling bad to the left.
Someone drove the car from the dealership to the fuel station, and obviously, it was pulling bad to the left.
The salesperson, Bobby, was driving the car around the lot, and I assume from the soda syrup on the seat bolster, probably took the car to get lunch, so he drove it while obviously, it was pulling bad to the left.

We paid $24,500 with $500 owner loyalty for the new Sonata, and I took delivery on Monday the 22nd. I had asked them specifically not to drill the holes in the front of the car for their dealer tags, as I live in Kentucky and we don't do front license plates, but there they were already - with their free advertising license plate frame in place.

I noticed driving the car home on Monday, that the car pulled to the left bad. This was unacceptable, but with holidays and family plans for Thanksgiving that week, it was going to have to wait. I texted and called my sales person, Robert Bucheit, on Monday evening and received no response. I called Tuesday morning and spoke with the service manager "Mike" and mentioned the pulling left issue. He said an alignment would fix the issue, and they had only seen this on a few cars. I told him we could only get it in there on Monday the following week, and he said it was nothing to worry about, and that was fine.

The wife called and griped about the car pulling to the left after driving it the first time, making the the same observations. We knew it had to wait until the following Monday, so we garaged the car, only putting 120 miles on it over the remainder of the week.

The following Monday (this week), the car's electrical system went kaput. It died, mid intersection on my (3 months pregnant) wife, and in a panic, she discovered that only by putting the fob into the dock that anything would respond. We limped the car home, and I called the dealership to setup getting it there Tuesday morning, since I was now stuck taking my panic-stricken wife to and from work for fear of driving the car again.

Yesterday morning, I took the car to Columbia Hyundai, and speaking to Jon McFarland, the General Sales Manager, I professionally and politely informed him that the failures with the car (now with 400 miles total on it) were unacceptable and that they needed to take the car back. Jon, politely informed me that the vehicle had already been titled in my name, that they had put substantial work into my trade-in, and that this could not happen because of the title.

I told him I didn't care what needed to be done, but I wasn't leaving with that car, or another new car in it's place. He again, politely, deferred to the title issue. He introduced me to the service manager, who personally sat in the car and looked at the issues as I described them. This gentleman's name was Bob. I informed Bob, it was great that they're looking at it, but I'm not leaving with the car - so take your time.

They gave me a loaner 2011 Sonata, and insisted that everything would be fine, and I'll take the car back in good order. Needing to get back to work, I left.

On lunch, I called my county clerks's office to see if the vehicle had been titled. It had not. I called the Hamilton County (dealership location in Ohio, I live in Kentucky) clerks' office and learned the same. The clerk asked where I had purchased and when, and laughed. "That won't be titled till the middle of next month sweetie." were her exact words.

I was upset about the vehicle problems before, and ended up livid after discovering I had been lied to. I called Jon McFarland at Columbia Hyundai and inquired about the status of the vehicle, and then informed him I had spoken with both clerk's offices, that the vehicle had not been titled, and that he had lied to me. He deferred to the fact that they had spent money fixing up my trade in and that it was too late to reverse the deal. I told him we would reconcile this at the end of the day, and I would be working with his boss, as he had lied directly to me and I was done dealing with him. He again, told me it wasn't happening and summarized that he was done fooling with me - though polite the whole time.

I called back and spoke with Bob the service manager, and went fishing for who the head honcho was. "Chuck" I believe, was who I needed to talk to, and Bob was going to set up the conversation. Bob also informed me that rotating the tires fixed the pulling left issue, and it had been out on 9 drive cycles. They had no explanation for the electrical failure other than they had replaced some fuses and everything was working now. I inquired why rotation of tires on a less than 400 mile vehicle would have anything to do with it pulling left if something was not wrong. He had no answer.

"Chuck" called me at 4:15 and told me it wasn't happening, that I was going to take the car after they kept it overnight to make sure it was better. I told him I was on my way, and I saw it differently.

Arriving at the dealership, I spoke with Chuck. He handed me the paperwork on the Tiburon we traded in, showing they put new tires, brakes, and a new rim on the car, put a pinstripe on the car, detailed it, and performed oil change and other maintenance, to the tune of $1000. They had also already paid off the $8000ish amount I owed on the Tiburon, and the lien was released. I asked him in what world that 4 tires and a brake job cost $1000 on a Hyundai - but he stood firm on what they had invested in the car. I told them fine, give me back my money I put down on the car, less the thousand bucks (all positive equity from the trade of about $5,000) - keep both cars, and I'm out of here. He didn't want the Tiburon, after putting all the work into it, including a huge "Hyundai Certified Pre-Owned" vinyl sticker in the rear window. The car was still in my name, I didn't ask for the work to be done, but they did it anyway. This appeared to be my only out, so I ran to the bank next door and got a cashiers check for what they paid out in pay off, plus the $1000. Effectively, I got my old car back with tires and a brake job for $1000.

They took back the Sonata, and the lemon is now their problem.

I have a case open with Hyundai documenting the whole procession. I am out to get my $1000 back, understanding that the tires and brakes are going to be something Columbia has to eat. I didn't ask for them, and it's the least they can do for the nightmare they put us through.

They delivered to us a car, with no less than 3 people driving it 120+ miles, that obviously was not right.
They had no explanation for the electrical issues.
Their solution to the pulling issue was not a solution; merely masking a problem that would later re-appear.

While the staff were all very polite and professional with me; the sales manager lied to my face, and the sales staff knowingly delivered me a bad vehicle.

I will not be sending any business to Columbia Hyundai again, and would caution anyone from buying a 2011 SE Turbo. This car is not production ready, and has bugs to be worked out yet.

Anyone want to buy a Tiburon?
 

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very interesting situation. I had something similar happen with Acura/Honda and I also filed a report with the BBB. Usually the dealer will try to contact you because of some pressure from the BBB, and they'll try to come to some sort of agreement with you

Make sure you contact Hyundai Corp office and stay in constant contact with them, try to even escalate your issue

Either way, I'm looking forward to see what happens next. Wish you the best of luck.
 

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I'm certainly not going to tell you that the dealership is 100% right in this scenario, as it seems you're quite heated.....But, our Turbo limited is also pulling to the left and we've already had it in once to be "fixed." I called Hyundai directly and got them involved. Things are moving along now and they are sending a Hyundai field engineer to look at it. Any car out there could have problems at some point in it's life, and the most likely candidate is one that has just come out. It's tough to have patience when you've paid so much for something and all you ask for is it to work properly.

As for the lemon law, most states say that there need to be a number of days/attempts to give the dealership a reasonable amount of time to fix your car. If it has been in for service a certain amount of days consecutively, it is then eligible for Lemon.

Finally, I know how frustrating it can be as my mom has been through a ton of issues in the first year of ownership of her Mazda CX-9. The worst problem was the car would intermittently cut out while normal driving. That was dangerous! Driving along at highway speeds and the car would just shut off. Anyway, they replaced the CPU and everything is fine now.

I wish there was a perfect car out there, but there are a lot of parts in every car that need to work together and sometimes it pays to be patient.

Also, cars now are including more and more electronic devices. In an effort to impress and protect potential buyers, any successful car company needs to offer the latest and "greatest" technology. I, for one, and learning to like older cars with less of the electric gizmos that seem to more annoying than anything.

Good luck with your new search.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
I have a 2000 Honda S2000 (original owner) that has 60,000 beat the balls out of it miles. I replaced the clutch at 25k and 45k, mainly from autocross/trips to the dragon/drag strip. The motor holds perfect compression on all cylinders, has never had any alignment or electronic issues, and still starts the first push every time. You go into buying a 9,000 RPM revving sports car with the expectation of some reliability overhead - you don't go into buying 4 door family saloon's for $25,000 brand new expecting anything to go wrong. Even with a sub, 2 amps, and a high wattage aftermarket radio, all LED lights, 75 watt HID upgrade - never blown a fuse or tripped a sensor.

There's good and bad of everything - but owning something in such fashion, and 6 Honda/Acura Vehicles as daily drivers since it's purchase, all of which have been equally as trouble free - you get an expectation of what your money should buy.

Someone converting from GM or Chrysler to Hyundai right now might find such a vehicle acceptable; my money will go to the quality manufacturer from now on, even if that isn't Honda/Acura in the future - it is right now.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Everyone always mentions that transmission thing. They voluntarily recalled anything impacted and extended the warranty on them.

GM recalls about 600,000 vehicles a quarter. Honda recalled 600,000 vehicles in 6 years or something like that.

There's a reason Honda is always atop the quality survey, the 10 best lists, and tops resale value; They're built right.
 

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You know, something else strikes me here:

We now have a Sonata with a couple hundred miles.
Its never been "titled" (which is typically the difference between used and new).

Wonder where this car is and how its being referred to as? Demo? Lightly used?
 

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in reality, once you sign thats it. manufacturer has to fix the car and if it does not get resolved, the buy back process begins.

can't blame the dealership. they are doing what they are told to do, sell the car. no offense but they are not paid to hear about your problems(not in sales at least) they get paid to sell the car and that is all. no other BS afterwards.

i don't know what you guys are talking about with pull to the left mine does not exhibit that issue and if it does, thats the characteristic of 274hp FWD car. get over it. if it pulls as you coast down, then yes there's a problem but when you're mashing the pedal to the metal, it will pull one side or to the other.

i love mine, no problems. absolute beauty too :)
 

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QUOTE (blacksapphirez @ Dec 1 2010, 05:29 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=376213
in reality, once you sign thats it. manufacturer has to fix the car and if it does not get resolved, the buy back process begins.

can't blame the dealership. they are doing what they are told to do, sell the car. no offense but they are not paid to hear about your problems(not in sales at least) they get paid to sell the car and that is all. no other BS afterwards.

i don't know what you guys are talking about with pull to the left mine does not exhibit that issue and if it does, thats the characteristic of 274hp FWD car. get over it. if it pulls as you coast down, then yes there's a problem but when you're mashing the pedal to the metal, it will pull one side or to the other.

i love mine, no problems. absolute beauty too :)
Yeah, our cars exhibit the problem all the time(very much more apparent at freeway speeds). I can be coasting in drive, coasting in neutral, maintaining speed in drive, or using cruise control. It will do it in all these scenarios the same amount. Very uncharacteristic of a well made automobile. My buddy bought a 2.0t the same time I did. Your words remind me verbatim of what he said when I told him about my left pull. A few days later I got a text which said...."ahhhh my car is pulling left. Now I believe you...annoying!"

If you got one that doesn't do it you are extremely lucky as far as I can tell. Now I know this forum is a small sampling of the number of 2.0t units sold. However, I would be willing to wager that the number of cars with this problem on this forum alone are in excess of 75% of the people who own a 2.0t. That's not a small problem no matter how you slice it.

No disrespect towards your post at all. Just clarifying what we are experiencing.

p.s. Thanks for the killer deal! You rock! (got your exact same car too down to the pearl white color) :thumbsup:
 

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QUOTE (pseudomaniac @ Dec 1 2010, 03:42 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=376172
Everyone always mentions that transmission thing. They voluntarily recalled anything impacted and extended the warranty on them.

GM recalls about 600,000 vehicles a quarter. Honda recalled 600,000 vehicles in 6 years or something like that.

There's a reason Honda is always atop the quality survey, the 10 best lists, and tops resale value; They're built right.
I BEG to differ. Let me tell you about MY experience with Acura/Honda and how much GARBAGE their company really is...

I own a 2002 Acura TL-S and the tranny on it has issues. Acura decides to extend the warranty on it. I experience many issues with the tranny while WITHIN the extended warranty and report it to BOTH the dealership and Acura Client Services, neither one of them fix the issue and tell me to come back once tranny completely blown. Few months later, tranny completely dies, I go back to dealer, he says it'll cost over $5k to fix. You can probably imagine how **** I was at the time. He informs me that I'm exactly 1 month out of warranty and should come sooner. I explain to him that I did report it to the dealership atleast 5-6 times, and even have a copy of a few of the invoices of when they checked the car. Long story short, he completely blows me off and says its $5k to fix. In the meantime, I call back Acura Client Services, and escalate my issue past their incompetent services reps, all the way to somebody called a "Case Manager", which is also completely useless and basically says that I'm out of luck and a month too late.

There have been thousands if not hundreds of thousands of reported cases of these tranny failures on the Acura TL from 1999-2003, and Acura never bothered to make it a recall, combine that with their TERRIBLE customer service, and you have the absolute worst company in the world. You can't just judge a company based on the quality of the vehicle they make, you have to also look at the service they provide you with after the sale. Honda isn't gonna make it far with their terrible attitude and service.

At this point, you could put a gun to my head or offer me a brand new Acura/Honda, I'd just tell you to pull the trigger, thats how fed up and upset I am with the whole situation.

The point of my story is that although Hyundai seems to have some sort of issue with the Sonata right now, atleast they will acknowledge it properly, apologize and even compensate you for it, and most of all, treat you with respect.

I think the biggest reason for this is the fact that large companies like Honda already have a very large client base, whereas companies like Hyundai are trying to still expand and acquire every customer they can, and they VALUE their customers, unlike Honda, who doesn't give a crap about you because it has soo many customers and is filthy rich....
 

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Bashing Honda/Acura does not address this issue. No car company is perfect. Honda just had a 16% sales increase for November so clearly business is good even with many product that are mature.

To think Hyundai values the customer any different than any other car company is naive.
 

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QUOTE (pseudomaniac @ Dec 1 2010, 04:42 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=376172
There's a reason Honda is always atop the quality survey, the 10 best lists, and tops resale value; They're built right.
So are Hyundais. They are coming out tops with JD Power, Consumer Reports, ALG residual values, etc.

Your experience with the Sonata is unfortunate. But then again, 2 warrantied defects on a new car is not exactly front-page news (although it might seem that way if you keep repeating them ad naseum, and embellishing the story with details like your wife being pregnant. My wife was pregnant twice. It happens.)

If it makes you feel any better, I once owned an '88 Honda Civic which had more problems when it was new than your Sonata... a constantly-overheating engine that could only be driven a few minutes at a time, distorted windshield and mirrors that needed replacing, warped trim pieces, defective upholstery stitching, squeaks and rattles, chronic ice buildup under the gear shifter, rapid-warp brake rotors, and an exhaust heat shield that rusted off after 1 year and was not covered under warranty. The next Honda was better, as were most of the Nissans which followed. My current Hyundai has, so far, been the best car of them all.

To each his own I guess. Better luck next time :57:
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
QUOTE (AcuraKidd @ Dec 1 2010, 10:08 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=376251
The point of my story is that although Hyundai seems to have some sort of issue with the Sonata right now, atleast they will acknowledge it properly, apologize and even compensate you for it, and most of all, treat you with respect.

I think the biggest reason for this is the fact that large companies like Honda already have a very large client base, whereas companies like Hyundai are trying to still expand and acquire every customer they can, and they VALUE their customers, unlike Honda, who doesn't give a crap about you because it has soo many customers and is filthy rich....
I know tons of people who have had the same experience with the transmission - and I don't think they handled it well. I'm the old school guy that still changes his own oil, does his own brakes, and has done more engine swaps on Civics/Integras than can be counted. My mindset when I buy the Honda/Acura product is it's going to be solid based on my experience, but if anything should go wrong, or if I'm too hard on something and break it - it's nothing a Saturday night on the garage floor can't fix, at minimal expense.

The S2000 I bought new - everything else I buy a year old and duck the overpriced Honda/Acura new car dollars - but I also then don't expect to ever go back to the stealership.

In this scenario, maybe I got the bad 1 out of 1000 - but the dealership I have purchased 3 vehicles from in 2 years fought me tooth and nail about returning it in one week / less than one tank of gas / hadn't even been titled yet, and made me buy my old car back for $1000 more than I got for it in trade because of work they'd done that it didn't "need".

What I'm mad at here is how the dealer handled things. The quality of the car aside - the dealer did nothing out of their way to give me a better experience, and as I said - knowingly delivered me a car that did not drive properly. I'm generally a pretty reasonable and rational fellow - but in this case, what they did was knowingly dirty - regardless of what they're selling. You just don't give someone something that's knowingly not what they paid for - and I didn't pay for a car that pulled left on the first mile.
 

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QUOTE (Shoot2Thrill @ Dec 1 2010, 08:35 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=376230
This characteristic is not in Acura FWD cars at real 270+ HP. What a nightmare!
This pulling (Torque Steer) only occurs when yu have uneven length half-shafts, many manufacturers try to give you half-shafts of equal length or close to it to minimize this torque steer. Yhis was present much more in the past, now very few cars have it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Hyundai corporate closed the case - said not their problem, work it out with the stealership.
 

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Really sorry to hear about your experience. Not sure who you contacted at Hyundai corp but I thought I'd share the following info I got from the Hyundai "Think Tank" Corp site:
<blockquote>
"Should you have specific questions please feel free to contact our Customer Affairs group directly. You can reach them via phone at 800-633-5151 or online at [email protected]."</blockquote>

Hope this helps.

Best of luck with your situation.
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
QUOTE (Doc_V @ Dec 2 2010, 02:14 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=376439
Really sorry to hear about your experience. Not sure who you contacted at Hyundai corp but I thought I'd share the following info I got from the Hyundai "Think Tank" Corp site:
<blockquote>
"Should you have specific questions please feel free to contact our Customer Affairs group directly. You can reach them via phone at 800-633-5151 or online at [email protected]."</blockquote>

Hope this helps.

Best of luck with your situation.

That was who I talked to. They were very friendly and facilitating, but ultimately, after seeing I had gotten rid of the car, despite owning another Hyundai, said see ya.
 

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QUOTE (pseudomaniac @ Dec 2 2010, 02:19 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=376441
That was who I talked to. They were very friendly and facilitating, but ultimately, after seeing I had gotten rid of the car, despite owning another Hyundai, said see ya.
If you unloaded the car why are you expecting them to continue to support you? Whether or not you own another Hyundai, this one is no longer in your possession so I dont see a legitimate reason Hyundai needs to assist you with the matter of this Sonata.
 
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