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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
They are finally starting to arrive in the USA. Took a limited model on a short test drive. Just wanted to see how it compared to the HEV. I was pleasantly surprised how long the EV system stayed in use. While I didn't take the freeway, I never even heard the ICE come into play. Mind you the turbo noise on the HEV bothered me a bit when I drove that one months ago. Unlike the Santa Fe (reported in forum) I had no problem in the second row running my shoes under the rear of the front seats. The rear storage is not as bad as I had expected, still there doesn't appear to be any way to fit in a spare. The regen brakes were fine. Only negative was the ride over bumpy roads wasn't that
good. It's possible the tire pressure was still high for transport mode.


I ultimately didn't buy it as the interior was black. Don't want the extra heat on a 100 plus day. Also, as expected the dealer was asking for more than 3k over list but it was for dealer add ons.
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2021 Stormy Sea Santa Fe Calligraphy 2.5L Turbo HTRAC 20" wheels
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The 3K over would be enough for me. If you can wait a year, the bugs will be worked out and hopefully prices will become more sane.
 

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2021 Stormy Sea Santa Fe Calligraphy 2.5L Turbo HTRAC 20" wheels
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They are just waiting for a pumpkin to come down the road that fell off of a turnip truck!
I pity the poor fool who buys this POS.
 

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Mind you the turbo noise on the HEV bothered me a bit when I drove that one months ago.
A little off topic question for you, but you heard a turbo noise on the HEV? I have one and haven't heard any turbo noise at all? I was actually hoping for a little bit of turbo spooling noise to capture some glory from my youth again, but oh well.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Small turbo sounds raspy to me when pushed. Luckily it doesn’t happen that often.
 

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If it weren't for the markup, I believe the PHEV is supposed to be cheaper than the HEV like for like after the $7.5K tax incentive, right? Just like the regular Tucson, typical that they are already at dealerships and yet the Hyundai website build tool isn't updated yet, lol!
 

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2021 Tucson, 2022 Tucson Hybrid
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That seems but going rate for nitrogen. The Toyota dealer by me charges $695. I’m NOT joking.


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This has been a very common markup here in South Florida for years. Of course I never paid for it.
What is a real problem is that there are not cars on the lots. Buyers are put in a waiting list expecting to get their cars in two or three months regardless of the brand. I know two guys that had to extend their lease because they are unable to get a new car. Crazy times we are living!
 

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If it weren't for the markup, I believe the PHEV is supposed to be cheaper than the HEV like for like after the $7.5K tax incentive, right? Just like the regular Tucson, typical that they are already at dealerships and yet the Hyundai website build tool isn't updated yet, lol!
If you qualify for the incentive. The IRS does not cut you a check. The incentive comes out of whatever you owe at the end of the year. If you owe nothing or expect a refund, your incentive is zero. See your tax advisor before you buy so you have a clear picture of how much of the incentive you can actually claim.
 

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If you qualify for the incentive. The IRS does not cut you a check. The incentive comes out of whatever you owe at the end of the year. If you owe nothing or expect a refund, your incentive is zero. See your tax advisor before you buy so you have a clear picture of how much of the incentive you can actually claim.
This is wrong. If you owe $0, you would get a $7,500 refund in the mail.

The only thing that matters is if you have enough taxable income after deductions, which the burden of that is very low, pretty much anyone making $50K or more would almost certainly qualify. Even if you withheld your tax burden perfectly so you owe nothing, you would then get the full check amount in your refund for that tax year.

If you're unemployed and on food stamps, then, yeah, you would have a problem.
 

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First, is the tax credit for the Tucson PHEV $7500? I'm not seeing the credit amount on Hyundai's website. I've googled a couple sites that claim $6587 is the credit. Edmunds disagrees with your understanding of the credit:

"...You'll often hear that a credit is worth "up to" a certain amount. "Up to" is the critical modifier. The federal incentive is usually referred to as a flat $7,500 credit, but it's only worth $7,500 to someone whose tax bill at the end of the year is $7,500 or more. Let's say you buy a Nissan Leaf or other eligible EV and you owe $5,000 in income tax for a particular year. That's all the tax credit will be. Uncle Sam's not writing a refund check for the other $2,500. And an unused portion of the credit can't be applied against the following year's taxes..."


I asked my tax advisor about the ev credit this year and he confirmed Edmund's advice. See your tax advisor before you buy.
 

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This is wrong. If you owe $0, you would get a $7,500 refund in the mail.

The only thing that matters is if you have enough taxable income after deductions, which the burden of that is very low, pretty much anyone making $50K or more would almost certainly qualify. Even if you withheld your tax burden perfectly so you owe nothing, you would then get the full check amount in your refund for that tax year.

If you're unemployed and on food stamps, then, yeah, you would have a problem.
This is 100% incorrect! The IRS will not issue you a refund check for EV credits... IRS will only credit your balance owed. If you owe $0 you'll get nothing from the IRS. If you owe $500 and you are expecting a $7.5k EV refund you'll only get $500. In order to receive the full EV credit, you'll have to owe that amount.
 

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How was the power of the 265hp plugin compared to the 226hp hybrid. Is it noticeable? I read a review that the 0-60mph was not that much better.
 

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This is 100% incorrect! The IRS will not issue you a refund check for EV credits... IRS will only credit your balance owed. If you owe $0 you'll get nothing from the IRS. If you owe $500 and you are expecting a $7.5k EV refund you'll only get $500. In order to receive the full EV credit, you'll have to owe that amount.
Sigh, you're both still confused.

No, the IRS technically isn't writing you a check no matter what, as I already explained. However, taxes are withheld based on how you file with your employer, and you can even choose to have nothing withheld. Depending on this, when you actually file your taxes you may end up having overpaid or underpaid your taxes. If you overpaid, then you get a refund and visa versa. However, even when you get a refund, it doesn't mean you didn't pay taxes, its just that those taxes were already withheld so that you didn't get a big bill at the end of the year.

So even if you are getting say $100 back, if you had more than $7.5K + $100 after deductions withheld, then you would end up getting a $7.5K tax refund. You had to pay $7.5K, but with this deduction you now owed $0, but you already paid $7.5K because you had it withheld and so you get a $7.5K refund.

Here's the actual table, so we don't go back with a stupid "nuh uh, uh huh" nonsense with no supporting documentation: https://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/i1040tt.pdf

So I was slightly off, but not by much, and with standard deductions a single filer would have to make $53,200 to get the $7.5K refund check from the IRS.
 

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...The only thing that matters is if you have enough taxable income after deductions, which the burden of that is very low, pretty much anyone making $50K or more would almost certainly qualify. Even if you withheld your tax burden perfectly so you owe nothing, you would then get the full check amount in your refund for that tax year.

If you're unemployed and on food stamps, then, yeah, you would have a problem.
I'm not unemployed or on food stamps and yet I know that my EV credit is zero because I'm retired and derive most of my income from social security. I suspect lots of people are in the same boat. I stand by my statement that you should see a tax advisor before making any EV purchase. There are several gotchas in the tax code that you should be aware of. You don't want to end up buying an EV in Nov of this year and do your taxes in Mar of next and then find out you need to sell a bunch of stocks or other assets to generate some tax liability so you can claim the credit. Then its too late.
 

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I'm not unemployed or on food stamps and yet I know that my EV credit is zero because I'm retired and derive most of my income from social security. I suspect lots of people are in the same boat. I stand by my statement that you should see a tax advisor before making any EV purchase. There are several gotchas in the tax code that you should be aware of. You don't want to end up buying an EV in Nov of this year and do your taxes in Mar of next and then find out you need to sell a bunch of stocks or other assets to generate some tax liability so you can claim the credit. Then its too late.
That's fine, but its not rocket science, and you don't have to have $7.5K in taxes due at the end of the year in order to qualify for the full amount and can absolutely get a check cut from the IRS, that is with certainty.

And yes, unemployed on untaxable social security benefits wouldn't pay either, I was just providing an obvious example that those that didn't pay income tax obviously can't get a credit or if married and filing jointly then as seen on the previous link it'd bump your income to $65,800 still well within average middle class. My point was simply that you don't have to owe a penny at the end of the year when filing in order to get a check cut for $7.5K out to you in the form of a refund. A lot of people think that, and they are completely wrong which a quick google can verify for you.
 

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That's fine, but its not rocket science, and you don't have to have $7.5K in taxes due at the end of the year in order to qualify for the full amount and can absolutely get a check cut from the IRS, that is with certainty.

And yes, unemployed on untaxable social security benefits wouldn't pay either, I was just providing an obvious example that those that didn't pay income tax obviously can't get a credit or if married and filing jointly then as seen on the previous link it'd bump your income to $65,800 still well within average middle class. My point was simply that you don't have to owe a penny at the end of the year when filing in order to get a check cut for $7.5K out to you in the form of a refund. A lot of people think that, and they are completely wrong which a quick google can verify for you.
How does an electric vehicle tax credit work?
The federal incentive is only worth $7,500 to someone whose tax bill at the end of the year is $7,500 or more. Let's say you buy a Hyundai Kona EV or other eligible vehicle and you owe $5,000 in income tax for that year. That's all the tax credit will be. The IRS will not issue you a refund check for the other $2,500. And an unused portion of the credit can't be applied against the following year's taxes. If you are leasing, the tax credit will go to the finance company, not you. The carmaker will likely factor the credit into the cost of the lease to lower your monthly payment, but it isn't mandatory.

[Electric Vehicle Tax Credits: What You Need to Know | Edmunds]
 

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How does an electric vehicle tax credit work?
The federal incentive is only worth $7,500 to someone whose tax bill at the end of the year is $7,500 or more. Let's say you buy a Hyundai Kona EV or other eligible vehicle and you owe $5,000 in income tax for that year. That's all the tax credit will be. The IRS will not issue you a refund check for the other $2,500. And an unused portion of the credit can't be applied against the following year's taxes. If you are leasing, the tax credit will go to the finance company, not you. The carmaker will likely factor the credit into the cost of the lease to lower your monthly payment, but it isn't mandatory.

[Electric Vehicle Tax Credits: What You Need to Know | Edmunds]
Oh my god... smashes face into keyboard

When they say owe income tax, that also includes taxes that are withheld THAT YOU ALREADY PAID, how are you not understanding this? Do you really think they would have written the tax code so that you simply wouldn't have any tax withheld in order to qualify for income tax incentives? If that were the case, then no one would withhold instead of almost everyone doing it.

Almost everyone pays income tax as "pay as you go" tax, meaning your employer automatically pays your income tax for you by not including it in your paychecks. You don't have to opt for this, but almost everyone does because there really isn't a downside and its safer and more convenient. While you may have owed $7.5K at the end of the year, if $7.5K was already paid little by little throughout the year by your employer on your behalf, then you owe $0. When you then go to file your taxes and have reduced your tax bill to $0 because you subtract $7.5K from the $7.5K you already paid, now you are sitting at a bill of -$7.5K so they write you a refund check for $7.5K. I feel like I'm just repeating myself, so I give up.
 

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Oh my god... smashes face into keyboard

When they say owe income tax, that also includes taxes that are withheld THAT YOU ALREADY PAID, how are you not understanding this? Do you really think they would have written the tax code so that you simply wouldn't have any tax withheld in order to qualify for income tax incentives? If that were the case, then no one would withhold instead of almost everyone doing it.

Almost everyone pays income tax as "pay as you go" tax, meaning your employer automatically pays your income tax for you by not including it in your paychecks. You don't have to opt for this, but almost everyone does because there really isn't a downside and its safer and more convenient. While you may have owed $7.5K at the end of the year, if $7.5K was already paid little by little throughout the year by your employer on your behalf, then you owe $0. When you then go to file your taxes and have reduced your tax bill to $0 because you subtract $7.5K from the $7.5K you already paid, now you are sitting at a bill of -$7.5K so they write you a refund check for $7.5K. I feel like I'm just repeating myself, so I give up.
I interpret it differently; if anyone knows differently I won't shy away from being incorrect :)

My local dealerships have also started receiving PHEV's I'm looking forward to purchasing one soon.
 
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