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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Hi! please, I need help with this:

My Hyundai Tiburon 2.7 v6 (2005) wont start after replace battery.
Im try bypass start relay (jump 87 to 30 wire) and crank and start runs! But i Replace relay dont work.

Tester volt 85-86 with key move to start position no show volt.
But i test 86 to positive battery +12.5v and... 85 to positive also +12.5v ?
At key position to Start, one of those 12.5v dump to 0v. (86 i remember but not sure)

Any cable diagram for this circuit?

Note this is 6 speed manual transmission, and this dont use cluth switch to start.
 

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At key position to Start, one of those 12.5v dump to 0v. (86 i remember but not sure)
I think you should recheck the 85 & 86 voltages again. The one that "dump to 0V" is probably actually switching to +12V.
+12V on the relay terminal would show zero on the meter when the measurement is taken with reference to battery positive.
And the fact that the voltage changes when you turn the key kinda tells you the circuit between the relay and the ignition switch is probably OK.

Did you try swapping the START relay with the one beside it to see if it cranks when they are swapped over? If it cranks you know the relay is bad. And now that you've moved the bad relay and got the engine cranking, your joy will probably be short lived because it probably wont run.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Yes, i change relay, but dont crank.

when relay socket (86) dump to 0v (key set to start) im test this to ground battery, nothing volt.

The test with 86 to 85 (with key set to start) this show 0v,

Im found this schematics, try to found “burglar alarm relay” but i dont know location.

444718
 

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try to found “burglar alarm relay” but i dont know location.
I found this unnecessarily large picture on a Google search. Looks like is behind the dash on the driver's side, beside the ignition switch...
 

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Jumping 30 and 87 ... engine cranks and runs
This means the circuit after the relay is good.
Replacing relay and not functioning means the control side of relay is suspect.

O volts, +12.5 volts with one end of probe at battery positive??
Test method seems off.
From battery positive to pin and 12.5 volt positive?
Wouldn't that mean that you have 25 volts??? No sense there.

Test with respect from ground. Both read 0 volts.
Then key to crank or start, one pin jumps to 12 volts
This means control side of relay is getting the necessary inputs

Relay becomes suspect.
Load side works (engine cranks and runs)
Control side works (voltage readings are good at socket)
 

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From battery positive to pin and 12.5 volt positive?
Wouldn't that mean that you have 25 volts??? No sense there
No, it just means the pin has a path to ground. It makes perfect sense.
 

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No, it just means the pin has a path to ground. It makes perfect sense.
If taking the reading from positive battery post and reading a positive 12.5 volts
Then the cumulative voltage would be 25 volts with respect to ground.
If it was a negative 12.5 volts then that makes sense.
Your mind is making it make sense by not listening to the actual words he used.
 

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If taking the reading from positive battery post and reading a positive 12.5 volts
Then the cumulative voltage would be 25 volts with respect to ground.
If the reading is +12.5V that just means the black meter probe was connected to a ground.

If it was a negative 12.5 volts then that makes sense.
If it was negative 12.5V that would mean he had connected his meter probes the wrong way round.

avisitor said:
Your mind is making it make sense by not listening to the actual words he used.
My mind is making it make sense because I'm an AUTOSPARK and I understand what he's talking about. But this is school boy physics is clearly going way over your head.
 

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If the reading is +12.5V that just means the black meter probe was connected to a ground.
The post did not say that. You assume that it was connected that way.
If it was negative 12.5V that would mean he had connected his meter probes the wrong way round.
Again you assume. I did mention in post #5 that the test method seems off to me.
But, you chose to focus on your superior ego.
You apparently decided not to read the rest of the post.
Only you could be right. Good for you.
My mind is making it make sense because I'm an AUTOSPARK and I understand what he's talking about. But this is school boy physics is clearly going way over your head.
Say what you want so that you feel better about yourself.
It is okay with me. I am not judging you.
Please don't belittle others or blame others for your own misunderstandings
That would be beneath a real Autospark.

You are getting side tracked and not helping the OP.
 

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The post did not say that. You assume that it was connected that way.
I don't assume assume anything. It's the only possible way to get a +12.5V reading on the meter.

avisitor said:
Again you assume.
Yes, I assume the laws of physics are true. That's a pretty safe assumption though.

avisitor said:
I did mention in post #5 that the test method seems off to me.
Yes, you did. But something isn't off just because you don't understand it.

avisitor said:
But, you chose to focus on your superior ego.
If that's what you call pointing out your school boy errors then I guess I'm guilty.

avisitor said:
Please don't belittle others or blame others for your own misunderstandings
Says the guy who giving me a hard time for pointing out his misunderstandings.

avisitor said:
You are getting side tracked and not helping the OP.
He hasn't posted back yet. He's probably still trying to figure out how to get 25V out of his 12V battery :unsure:
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Sorry, maybe I haven't explained it correctly.

Autospark is right.
Pin 86 (when the key is NOT positioned at start) is grounded, pin 85 is always grounded.

When the key is turned to start, pin 86 is no longer grounded, but between pin 85-86 there are no volts, the relay does not receive power to make the jump at 87-30.

I tested the white wire that comes out of the ignition switch, I see that it's okay, when I turn the key to start, it shows 12v.

I still can't find the burglar alarm relay, and this afternoon I will try to follow the white wire.
 

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Sorry, maybe I haven't explained it correctly.
No need to apologise. There was nothing wrong with your explanation.
Maybe folk who don't understand simple electrical fault finding should just sit back and follow the thread and maybe learn something rather than reaching for their keyboard.

KrK said:
Autospark is right.
Oh, don't say that. You'll start him off again :)

KrK said:
I still can't find the burglar alarm relay, and this afternoon I will try to follow the white wire.
Sorry the picture isn't very clear. It looks to me like the relay is mounted in towards the side of the heater box. You can see the ignition key in the photo (blue), so the red part will be the ignition switch harness connector. Looks like the relay is in a little further than the ignition switch and towards the right.

BTW, I meant to ask...you've posted on the Canada forum. Do you live in Canada, or are you from Spain?

444760
 

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In this shot (a still from the video below) it looks like the relay is right behind the ignition switch...
444761


 

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Here is something else that might be relevant :
From what you describe happening with the voltages at the START relay, it sounds to me like the alarm relay is switching on when you turn the key to the crank position. That should only happen when the car's alarm system is armed. Do you have the remote to disarm the alarm? If not, or the remote isn't working for some reason you can usually disarm the alarm using the ignition key...
444762
 

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Sorry, maybe I haven't explained it correctly.

Autospark is right.
Pin 86 (when the key is NOT positioned at start) is grounded, pin 85 is always grounded.
Reading no voltage on pin 85 doesn't mean it is grounded.

When the key is turned to start, pin 86 is no longer grounded, but between pin 85-86 there are no volts, the relay does not receive power to make the jump at 87-30.
[/QUOTE
Pin 85 is not grounded that is why you measure no voltage between 86 and 85

I tested the white wire that comes out of the ignition switch, I see that it's okay, when I turn the key to start, it shows 12v.

I still can't find the burglar alarm relay, and this afternoon I will try to follow the white wire.
Okay, ....
 

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Reading no voltage on pin 85 doesn't mean it is grounded.
No voltage? Did you read the opening post? Specifically this part..."But i test 86 to positive battery +12.5v and... 85 to positive also +12.5v".
 

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Discussion Starter #18
Yes, I am from Spain, and I live in Spain. I found this forum by google :)
Finally I found the alarm relay!
This relay has 5 pins, but four wires enter this
It has the pink wire, two white and one green / black.

C814E674-EBE1-4E2F-8897-3981018D2F67.jpeg

The pink wire does not know where it is going, but it is fully connected with another white wire in the external fuse box and this with the starter relay.
444772

When I turn the key to start, the relay turns on, and cuts off the jump between the pink wire and one of the white wires.
When I don't turn the key, the pink wire and one of the white ones jump, communicating the starter relay with the white wire that comes out of the ignition switch.

The relay does exactly the opposite of what I want !!!!

I suppose if I remove the power to the alarm relay, power will come to the starter relay and the car will start, but I have not tried without knowing that it is safe.

@AUTOSPARK yes, i have remote alarm switch. This works, Unlock and lock.

Will it be a fault in the alarm system?
 

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Discussion Starter #19
Here is something else that might be relevant :
From what you describe happening with the voltages at the START relay, it sounds to me like the alarm relay is switching on when you turn the key to the crank position. That should only happen when the car's alarm system is armed. Do you have the remote to disarm the alarm? If not, or the remote isn't working for some reason you can usually disarm the alarm using the ignition key...
View attachment 444762
okay! thanks, tonight i will try this too
 

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The simple fix is just to cut the green/black wire. That wire is the ground for the relay coil, coming from the BCM/Alarm. It can't turn on with that ground disconnected.
I'd cut it an inch or so back from the connector so there is enough wire left for you to rejoin it later if required.
 
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