[smaclary]

Car ran dangerously low on oil (oil leak that we didn't know was present) and started knocking quite badly.
I pulled the valve cover to check the lifters and everything seemed fine up top. I tried to drop the oil pan but I couldn't get it to separate from the block.
If I can remove the oil pan are the main and rod bearings that hard to change or do they require special tools?

 

[rmissourimule]

If it a "lighter" knock it is probably a rod bearing. Those can be changed out fairly easy. If it is a "deep" knock it is probably a main bearing. You'll need to get at the bottom of the engine and hopefully change those before the crank is damaged or you are also looking at a new crankshaft. Personally, I would consider swapping the engine out. They have warehouses of various engines with low mileage that you can find on ebay at not unreasonable prices. Trying to repair an engine is chancy at best but swapping a complete engine is relatively easy.

 

[smaclary]

QUOTE (rmissourimule @ Oct 17 2010, 01:01 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=364090

If it a "lighter" knock it is probably a rod bearing. Those can be changed out fairly easy. If it is a "deep" knock it is probably a main bearing. You'll need to get at the bottom of the engine and hopefully change those before the crank is damaged or you are also looking at a new crankshaft. Personally, I would consider swapping the engine out. They have warehouses of various engines with low mileage that you can find on ebay at not unreasonable prices. Trying to repair an engine is chancy at best but swapping a complete engine is relatively easy.

I'd like to attempt to swap the bearings for the time being if possible. What's the easiest way to get the bloody oil pan off?

 

[rmissourimule]

That I can't help you with. I've never had the pan on this particular engine. I'm sure someone else here could better assist you. My point was that I can differentiate between rod and main bearings. IF YOU ARE LUCKY, the bearing surfaces might not be unduly damaged. Rod bearings can be easily changed out. Main bearings is a whole different matter and may require pulling the engine and putting it on an engine stand to do it properly. You would probably want to change the end seals anyway. I have run an engine briefly without any oil pressure but I wouldn't push my luck. I had a Ford Ranger that had a clogged pick-up screen and had to unclog it and put a new pan gasket on it but it was a tight job on a conventional rear wheel drive vehicle. On a combo transaxle I would have to look at it to even know where to begin. A shop manual can tell you how to do this. But as I was saying, I would STRONGLY consider changing out the engine. When I last looked I saw several warehouses of engines that are available to be purchased and shipped.

Two people I know rebuilt their Toyota and Honda engines only to have many more problems after the work and spending over a thousand dollars and lost time. I doubt it would differ much on a Hyundai engine. the complication today is much more difficult than in the old days when the engine wasn't buried under a mountain of wires, sensors and everything else to get in your way.

If the bearings are really bad, you can "grenade" an engine and it is not a pretty sight. I once observed an older Ford Bronco come into a service station knocking up a storm and then blew up. As hard as it may be to believe a piece of the camshaft which is the top of the engine fleew through the engine and oil pan and rolled out on the pavement along with the oil draining out. The engine was completely totaled; obviously.

I would suggest one thing you could do to determine the extent of the problem. Drain the oil and see if you can find any evidence of bearing material in the pan. It will be shiny and obvious. If not, it possible that the oil pump failed and you could simply replace it and be back in business. But as I say, you need to identify the problem first.

 

[sbr711]

If it is knocking, damage is done, either journal is torn up, or bearing shell spun in bore.. you wasting your time and money.

Replace at minimum any part associated with bearing, rod or block, crank repair/clean-up with all new bearings, then at that rate, overhaul while apart.

I can sell you a NIB Hyundai short block for maybe $1500 (need to check my parts pricing on Monday to be sure), thne add oil pump, misc goodies/gaskets to reassemble and be ready to run.

 

[rsquared]

Before you tare apart or change the engine...is the knock coming from the top or bottom of the engine?

 

[jojeboz]

I have a similar issue. Knock in the lower part of the engine. Probably showing my ignorance but how do you access the rod bearings after the oil pan comes off?

 

[The_AirHawk]

I have a similar issue. Knock in the lower part of the engine. Probably showing my ignorance but how do you access the rod bearings after the oil pan comes off?

There is a capscrew or stud and nut on each connecting rod (the "big end"). The best way to access them from below (I'm assuming you have the car on a lift, jackstands, or over a pit), will be to rotate the crankshaft (by hand/tool) and remove the fasteners and caps from each "pair" of cylinders - #1 and #4; #2 and #3.

PAY ATTENTION to the orientation, and to which connecting-rod each cap belongs! They may or may not be marked.

The bearing is a small "shell" inside the cap, and the upper-part of the connecting rod.

If there is any crankshaft rod-journal damage (burn marks, scoring, galled metal, gouges, etc.) the crank is probably junked, for your purposes. Same goes for the connecting rods - ANY "out of round" or if the rod is discoloured or appears that the shell has "spun" inside the rod - they're junk.

If everything is "OK" under a particular cap (especially the condition of the crankshaft), take care not to scar the bearing-surface with the "loose" rod when rotating the engine to check the next pair - reassembly of the bearing/cap would be prudent, or at the very least push the piston/rod up into the cylinder bore. It is unlikely there is enough clearance inside the crankcase to "push the rod out of the way" off to the side of the crank.

Good Luck, you're gonna need it.

I think your money would be better-spent on a new-used engine, IMHO.

 

[jojeboz]

Thinking the same thing, but used engines are so scarce in KY. I can't find one less than $1200 and that's with high miles. Guess we'll see. Can't hurt to look I guess. Thanks for the post!

 

[Amcis]

How did you go with the repair? I have the same/similar issues with my wife's 2001 model. I spent the time and overhauled the top end thinking it was a lifter issue, only to later find out it must be a rod/bearing issue Everyone is telling me to get a new engine. I can't find one for under around $3,000 here in Australia. I am thinking I may have to try to change the rods and bearings myself.

 

[charrliy525]

MY girls car is a 2001 elantra and 3 weeks ago after running from tampa florida to daytona and all around orlando(sea-world,lego-land,Then to daytona beach,then back on I4 to home) She started hearing a knocking sound just before her exit so she got off I4 pulled in gas station right at exit and got gas and checked her oil and water and belts etc and everything looked good. So she cranked it up and heard no knock and pulled out and once she started going(I assume once it hit 1K-1500K RPM is when knock came back) No less then 1/4 mile is 1st stop light,So she turned it off at light so it wouldnt knock sitting there,Then when turned green to go it wouldnt crank back up(THIS IS WERE SHE GOT LUCKY AS ****).
sO PUshed it aside,got it towed home,Next day i tryed it and wouldnt turn over,No click-click-click like bad starter or any of that until my 5th or 6th try then it clicked cuz she loves trying till she kills the battery,So i charged it up and from past cars i kept trying to bump it,As in,Turn the key to start but doin it,On-Off-On-Off etc,Yaa know like really quik,start then release like u would if it did start then start etc,Ive had cars lock up in the past and free up with that method. After 5 mins of nothing i jacked it up removed tire and tryed to manually spin motor,It`d only turn backwards 2 inches then forward 2 inches,turn backward far as it would go then hit the key,done that 2ice and nothing,locked up.
So pulled everything,pulled head, cams and all checked out so thats when i actually pulled the head cuz i knew i was pulling the oil pan next and sure enough a rod bearing went,snapped the cap odd,both nutts and half a bolt was in the pan and luckily the rod got cuaght between the block and crank when she turned it off so all i did was redid the top end since it was off,replaced the 1 rod and all 4 bearings,all standard size, ran 5 oil changes through it no more then 20 miles on each to remove the water and gunk left behimd from all the cleaning i did and she`s running great again.
Car just hit 100K miles on it on that trip. Total in parts 550.00,My machine shop guy for the head only,80.00, Then 200.00 for all the oil changes and degreaser and only took me 1 day tear it down,1 day back together,Took almost 2 weeks waiting on parts. These hyundais are the easiest cars to work on out of everything i`ve ever worked on.Hondas,yotas etc,kia`s,daiwoos all suck too work on these hyundais have plenty of room if you look hard at it first,buy and read the manual for tips but not as a guide,and do it.
But do your home work,some hyundais have mitsubishi parts mixed with hyundai installed on them so you need to know what motor,etc you have before buying parts and buy from partswarehouse etc local stores special order just online but charge way more.
Very easy cars to work on,I tell everyone BUY HYUNDAI,PARTS ARE VERY CHEAP TILL THEY HIT THE 10 YEAR MARK THEN THEY GO UP,BUT EVERY MAKE USUALLY DOES THAT. ANY ?`S HIT ME UP,
P.S.
DID IT ALL IN THE CAR,NEVER REMOVED THE MOTOR,MORE THEN ENOUGH ROOM TO WORK,WATER PUMP PULLY 4 BOLTS ONLY THING THATS TIGHT TO REMOVE BUT ANGLE AND PATIENCE ITS OFF IN 5 MINS ON IN 10.

 

[missfire]

I'm in the same predicament but I'm attempting to rebuild the engine. The oil pan is on there very well. They used some special sealant at the factory because of all the cars I've ripped pans off of this has got to be one of the most stuck on but also fragile pans ever be carefuel. When you have the pan off your going to run into the balance module/ oil pump thats chained to/behind the crankgear. You will need to remove the timing cover and bottom portion of the tensioner and guides to remove the bolts holding the module/pump. Then slide this unit forward towards the passenger side of the vehicle and the lower chain will be able to be removed. Then you will have access to the rod caps and bearings or whats left of them. Figure out which cylinder you have rod play in and try just replacing that upper and lower bearing. May not work for long but itll get you by if you don't want to do a full rebuild or buy a new engine.