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Getz 2003 1.1l
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi, I recently bought a 2003 1.1l Getz with progressively worse starting problem..
I check the air filter, the sparks, clean the injectors, the idle valve, the map/iat sensor, replaced the spark plugs, and finally yesterday also the fuel filter; but continues not to start.
So, I removed one spak plug but now can't see neither the spark, neither the fuel being ejected from the hole.
The immobilizer light turns on like always (I think).
The check engine light is on but can't read any errors.
So, i suspected the camshaft/crankshaft sensor/sensor wiering. Since disconnecting the camshaft sensor connector will cause an error and disconnecting the crankshaft won't i think it's unlikely that the camshaft is the problem.
I went to measure the voltage at the crankshaft sensor connector but the readings don't make any sense to me.
Does anyone have any suggestions and/or the circuit diagram?
 

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Replace the crank sensor.
 

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OK. We use a scope to check them. A resistance test is only valid if it fails the test.
 

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Getz 2003 1.1l
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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
If the sensor doesn't even get power, the scope is useless.
Do you have the circuit diagram?
 

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Drives : Nissan NV200 Flies : Rans S6ES
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If the sensor doesn't even get power, the scope is useless.
Your right. So you should check that the sensor is getting power before you do the scope test. Actually, you should check it's getting power & ground even if you don't intend to do the scope test.

Disconnect the sensor, switch the ignition on, and use your voltmeter to measure the voltage on each terminal of the sensor's harness connector. I think on the 1100 engine one terminal will have 12V, one will have about 9V and the third should have 0V. The 0V terminal should be the sensor ground, so to check that the ground is good connect the red meter probe to battery positive and touch the black probe to the 0V terminal. It should show 12V now if the ground is good.
 

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Getz 2003 1.1l
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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Thank you for repliying,
based on the colors and size of the wire I assume:
big red --> +12v
big black --> gnd
small yellow --> signal
Anyway I've checked all the possible combinations and the only readings i can get are the followings (foto).
445362
 

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From your photo it looks like your measuring the voltage between two terminals on the connector (+ & S).
You should measure the voltages against ground. In other words connect the black meter probe to battery negative then touch the red to each terminal of the sensor's harness connector. With the ignition switched on you should have 1 terminal showing 12V (power supply), one showing 0V (ground), and one showing a lower voltage (signal). Then you should check that the 0V terminal is in fact ground as I explained in my previous post.
 

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Getz 2003 1.1l
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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
I already did that but always get 0v, apart for the two combinations above. Seems really strange to me..
 

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I found the sensor pinout that I posted on another thread...


Here is a LINK to that thread. You'll find some cam & crank scope traces there.
 

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Three wire sensor
One is 12 volts
Another is ground
The third should be signal line

While not cranking, the signal line should remain steady
While cranking, the signal line should have a varying voltage (ac voltage?)

Check voltage at terminals with respect to battery ground
(one probe on battery negative and the other probe at one of the terminals)
One terminal should be 12 volts. Another should be zero. Third could be around 5 to 9 volts??
When determining ground, one probe is on the battery positive and the other is at ground terminal
Good reading is 12 volts.

It is not always easy to be clear about the tests being done.
Did you check for sparks at the plugs?
Did you check for injector pulse?
Did you listen for fuel pump to prime fuel rail or run during crank?
How does the engine sound while cranking?
 

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Getz 2003 1.1l
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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
I've checked for sparks at the plug.
I've checked for fuel injector pulse (from the hole of the spark plug).
Yes, the pump primes the fuel rail.
Nothing in particular that I can hear.
I have triple checked the voltages at the (disconnected) crankshaft position sensor connector, I've mesured as follows:
(key in acc/ignition position)
1 to 2 --> 0v
1 to 3 --> 0v
2 to 3 --> 0v
1 to gnd --> 0v
2 to gnd --> 12v
3 to gnd -->0v
1 to +12v --> 0v
2 to +12v --> 0v
3 to +12v --> 0v
 

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1 to +12v --> 0v
Looks like the sensor ground is open circuit. Possibly the signal wire too, but I'd focus on the ground for now.
A quick & dirty fix would be to just splice a length of wire onto the harness wire that is connected to terminal one (the black, I'd assume), then crimp an eyelet onto the other end and secure it under a convenient bolt on the engine. See if that gets it running.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
I've just checked the resistance of the sensor and it seems to be completely shorted.
Is that normal?
 

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It's a hall effect sensor, so you don't normally test it by measuring it's resistance.
Usually a hall sensor has a very high resistance though. You seem to be saying your has a very low resistance...short circuit.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Yes, I confirm it's a short circuit..
So, my guess is that the sensor went bad and fried the ECU.
This is my first car, but I play with elecronics since I was ~7, if it is necessary I could try to repair the ECU.
 

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A shorted sensor wouldn't explain why the sensor ground has gone open circuit. And why hasn't the supply fuse blown if the sensor has a dead short?

My advise is focus on the fault you can see...the sensor ground. We don't know what the resistance of the sensor is supposed to be. Hyundai don't publish a resistance value for it because that's not how it should be tested. I'm telling you that "generally" they have a high resistance. That doesn't necessarily mean that particular sensor does.
 

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Getz 2003 1.1l
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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
****.
I was mesuring the wrong connector (coils)...
I was watching another engine..
Sorry for wasting your time.

445380
 

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Getz 2003 1.1l
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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
I've disconnected the right connector, and no errors appear on the computer (check engine light still on).
The voltages seems to be ok: I have 12V, 8.5V, GND.
Should I check with a scope?
 
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