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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hello everyone. First post from a potential HSH owner. This body style has been catching my eye for awhile. I recently came across a dealer that has some left over 2011 models. Yes, leftover 2011s. Still brand new. I go into the dealer once in awhile and asked about them this week. I was told that they haven't been a good seller for the area. I've been thinking about them over the last few days and will be going in to talk about one tomorrow.

Sticker price - $30,171. I believe the price is about $18k If the mileage listed is accurate it only has 9 miles on it. It has the Premium Package.

I have a few questions -

1 - Would you have any concerns with buying a left over 2011? It's 3 years old but has no mileage. It's like getting 50k free miles plus it would still have the full warranty. At least that's what I'm thinking.

2 - I read that Hyundai overstated gas mileage ratings for this model. What kind of real world mileage have owners been seeing from their 2011s? I currently drive a Chevy Cobalt. On average I see about 30 MPG for a mix of city/highway/country road driving. I'd like to at least see that but really want to be in the low-mid 30s for the same driving mix.

3 - Any issues that I should know about? I presume that if I go with this the dealer will take care of any recalls/updates that are out for the car. I read that there are a few.

I'm trying to soak up as much knowledge about this car as I can before tomorrow morning. This will be my first Hyundai. I'm a car guy and usually into performance vehicles but I need a good, reliable family vehicle that is good on gas and attractive styling is a plus. Any info will be greatly appreciated.

Thank you!
 

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1. My only concern will be it's HEV battery and any residue build up since I doubt they changed the oil every 6 months or started the vehicles. The body is aged for 3 years as well and sitting in a parking lot. I dunno I guess it all depends on how well the dealership maintained it and that's a hit or miss.

2. Yes they did. You can check out my fuelly here: Caroline (Hyundai Sonata Hybrid) | Fuelly

However my last 3 fill ups have been ethanol free fuel.

3. Get the ECU and all other components updated with the latest firmware. That's the only issues I had but I bought used and the previous owner only had his seat adjusted according to records to include his vehicle purchase documents still in the glove box.

I also drove the turbo model and had nothing but issues with it. It's a wonderful car but I got fed up and got a hybrid. Since I performed the ECU update I hadn't had any other complaints.

Oh yeah. Can't find any run flats in the current premium size.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
I'm going to say that the cars just kind of sit until sold. Moved to plow the lot during the Winter but that's about it. The car is currently in their showroom.

I see that a majority of your driving is in the city. I'm guessing mileage would be better if you were doing about 75% highway?
 

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That's the car we have been driving for 3 years and just love it. Make sure that the service dept installs these TSB recall's for 2011:

HEV MULTI-ECU UPDATE (SERVICE CAMPAIGN TG5)
NVLD INSPECTION/REPLACEMENT (SERVICE CAMPAIGN TG6)
BATTERY CABLE TERMINAL REPLACEMENT (SERVICE CAMPAIGN TG7)
COOLING FAN RESISTOR REPLACEMENT (SERVICE CAMPAIGN TG8)
HEV HPCU INTER-LOCK CIRCUIT CONNECTOR INSTALLATION (SERVICE CAMPAIGN TI2)


ECU Update of June 2013

Every 2011-2012 should get it but you have to complain about hesitation and jerky behavior when the engine is cold. It is a free update that any Hyundai service can perform but some dealers will balk at giving it unless they can duplicate the problem.. It will give you much better performance and many better mpg.

13-FL-004
HEV MULTI-ECU UPDATE – VERSION 2

Description:
This bulletin provides information related to a software update of the following controllers:ECM/TCM/HCU/MCU/AHB/OPU by GDS Event#302, and BMS by Event#303.
This ECU Update will refine vehicle drivability, HEV transaxle shifts, and cruise control.
Applicable Vehicles: 2011-2012MY SONATA (YF) 2.4L Hybrid Electric Vehicle (HEV)
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Thanks for the info! My Google is full of Sonata searches tonight. Don't know what will happen when I goto the dealer. Sometimes deals seem to good to be true but I'll keep an open mind.
 

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This is me going at 45mph for a few miles steady which most would consider country roads after a fill up with REC-90 fuel (ethanol free).

At 55mph though you can easily achieve 40+mpg while 70mpg gives me about the estimated 40mpg. City driving will always take a beating however my counterparts see 26mpg or less while at worst I have seen 28mpg with the hybrid and that was stop and go in the I-95 during the holiday rush timeframe.

I now fill up 4 tanks instead the usual 6 when I had my turbo. That's a $120 savings.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
I thought about this more after I woke up this morning. I still think it's a good idea to check out the car. I know the car is new but there is a part of me that wonders if there is anything wrong with it to still be sitting on the lot 3 years later. Or, if there are any issues that will pop up because it just sat.
 

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There's the warranty to fall back on, yes? Unless it's some obnoxious color, like "chartreuse," it might be the best deal you've made in a long time. (It kind of bothers me that I not only know what color chartreuse is, but that I can type the word without the aid of spellcheck. :eek:)

I've seen several non-Hyundai dealers with NEW, untitled, 2-year old models still on their lots. First thing the salesman told me, "The manager is willing to look at any offer for this car, regardless of how crazy it may be. He wants it off his lot." Usually these vehicles are found out in rural dealerships where there is less showroom traffic. The buying public has this notion that they can get a better deal in the Big City where the competition for their disposable dollar is greater. :grin:
 

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I love my car (2011, HSH base model) but I would not buy a new 2011 today.

2011's don't have lifetime battery warranty and the fact this car has sat for possible 3 years on the lot (could be just over 2 really) worries me.

The other thing that worries me is the fact the dealer cannot sell a 2011 car (not knowing the area... like Rich says, could be a more rural area). The 2012 came out in February of 2012. I got my 2011 in January of 2012.

I would recommend the Sonata Hybrid car to just about anyone, but I wouldn't suggest buying a new 2011 when the 2014 model year are set to be announced in the next month. I'd wait until the 2014s come out and pick up a 2013, yes you'd be paying more than 18 but I think it would be worth it over a car that has sat so long.
 

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I've seen several non-Hyundai dealers with NEW, untitled, 2-year old models still on their lots.
I agree with a non-hybrid car that buying a new 2 year old car would save you some cash! But with a hybrid (not just Hyundai) I wouldn't do it...
 

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2011's don't have lifetime battery warranty and the fact this car has sat for possible 3 years on the lot (could be just over 2 really) worries me.

The other thing that worries me is the fact the dealer cannot sell a 2011 car (not knowing the area... like Rich says, could be a more rural area).

I would recommend the Sonata Hybrid car to just about anyone, but I wouldn't suggest buying a new 2011 when the 2014 model year are set to be announced in the next month. I'd wait until the 2014s come out and pick up a 2013, yes you'd be paying more than 18 but I think it would be worth it over a car that has sat so long.
I agree with a non-hybrid car that buying a new 2 year old car would save you some cash! But with a hybrid (not just Hyundai) I wouldn't do it...
Excellent points and well worth considering. The fact that it has sat at the dealer's for several years does have me going, "hmm..." At that low of a price, would an extended warranty that covers EVEYTHING be worth it, in this case? The price added wouldn't put it over the prohibitive top of owning it, yes? Considering the batteries, electronics, etc.? Just throwing this idea out there for consideration and discussion.

I know, if it was me, an extended warranty (remember it is price negotiable, as well) might go a long way to helping the me feel warm and fuzzy about the decision on whether or not to purchase the vehicle. Heck, maybe the dealer will "give you one" for next to nothing just to get it off his lot.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Update- the '11 didn't start. We tried a jumper box and then jumping it with a car but no luck. Everything worked fine. Radio, sunroof opened/closed like normal, windows ect..., but the car wouldn't start. We both thing the main battery is to dead to start it unless there is another issue. Car has 6800 miles on it. Was a loaner when customer's cars went in for service so it's been driven/just didn't sit doing nothing. Has the remainder of the factory warranty. Price is $18k. Sticker is $31,840. Pretty much loaded.

Overall it doesn't seem to bad if there aren't any issues. My current car is ok but the mileage is getting up there (89k) and no warranty. This is almost a new car, would have a warranty for many years plus it's like having about 45k miles to use for free. 2011s are probably in the 50-60k range now so with the 20k that I drive per year, I'll still be under mileage in 4 years. And selling it then, it would be a low mileage car.

Dealer gave me a '12 to take home for a day. I'll touch base tomorrow to see how the '11 is doing. I'll swap if it's ready.
 

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Let's be realistic here.

The vehicle is not 31K. The real sticker price is 18K. The devaluation of the vehicle since 2011 makes it so even with 9 miles on the ODO. the value it had is already gone. By driving it off the lot you will lose more value and to top it all off it has 6800 miles. It has been driven by all types of drivers which is already my first red flag.

The remainder of the factory warranty is 5 years or 60K for powertrain. Meaning you only have 2 years left. Yes 100K or 10 years sounds nice but you need to read the fine print which only covers certain items. This does not include thing's like the radio for example. That radio with nav is quite pricey if repairs are needed and are not part of the warranty.

Be advised that in order for you to even be considered for the warranty then it must be a certified pre-owned. Secondary owners are not included as part of the warranty no matter what the dealer tells you. Try to make a claim and expect to get hurt.

A car that does not start is a clear indication that they are trying to jump ship over a vehicle they already know will start to become expensive to maintain. The 18K is not a deal and rather it's a way for them to get full current value while giving you a remaining bit of warranty which they already know will expire in a few years regardless of advertised 100K/10 years.


My personal opinion is that you get a new 2013-14 because of the following:

1. Higher density battery and smaller dimensions means increased mileage on EV and larger trunk space.

2. Higher capacity electric motor

3. Problems with shifting are nearly non existent with newer 2013+ models which have been a problem with 2011's.


If you really want this 2011 then make sure it's running, the oil and filters have been changed for the transmission and the engine, tires have been balanced and tired are in good condition. Do a drive test with the vehicle you are purchasing and not a vehicle like the 2012 which is probably in mint condition. Also verify all warranty information with "Hyundai" and not the dealership.

Don't make an impulsive buy.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 · (Edited)
Thought they were giving me a '12 but looked at the sticker after posting the above and found that it's a '13. Impressions after driving around for 70 miles. Very nice car. Comfortable, quiet, roomy, transition between electric and gas is smooth and fuel mileage is good. I found myself watching the display a lot and driving for fuel economy. i'm not as good as some of the hypermilers here but I can drive like there is an egg under the pedal. I reset everything after I left the dealer, got on the highway about a mile later and saw mileage between 45.5 and 47.1. Speed ranged between 60-65 with a little burst up to 70. By the end of my loop I had tossed a little stop/go city driving in and was at 41.3 when I got home.

Now onto the 2011. I totally understand what you are saying. I'm not in a position to buy a new 2013 right now. Actually, I don't want the higher car payment. I had big payments years ago and have finally worked down to the sub-$250. range which I am happy with. I know, different car and better quality but I don't want to break $300. When I came across this one, I ran the numbers and found that I'd be in the $280. range unless I put a little more money down. For that I'd be getting a loaded Sonata that should last me for many years. I guess what it comes down to is I want to go with this one if everything is fine with the car. The non-start issue... maybe the battery is totally dead?

One thing that I'm wondering is about is they told me the car would be sold as used. It was never titled so shouldn't it be considered new? The way that I understand things is a vehicle is new unless it's been titled to someone. Don't know if there is a mileage limit to that.

I have the vin #. Is there a way for me to look up info about this car? I doubt there is a Carfax because the car should be new.
 

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I'm not sure if you were mistaken in your initial info or they changed details on you.

Either way... I would walk away from this car totally.

Something when trying to jump start the hybrid. You can fry things that would need parts sent in from Korea.

When I went to buy my car I really wanted a silver one. The dealership had a silver one in their computers. Neither me, nor the sales guy could find it on the lot. He even went back into the detailing and service bullpens trying to find it. Turns out it was off lot waiting for parts. One of the lot workers had tried to jump start it and did it wrong. It fried something and they could NOT sell the car as new anymore.

Why did I tell you this? Just to be careful. This one could have had issues before that and by why it ended up being a loaner car.

Your car is still moving right? Just getting higher in milage? Do you have payments now?

One thing michieru said that rings with me too. Being this was a dealer loaner. You don't know who drove it. I'll be honest... I'm not the nicest to the dealer loaner cars. I don't drive them into walls or anything... but I am also harder on the motor/brakes of those, then I would be of my own car.
 

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And if you want to pay for a check on the VIN... yes you can check carfax/autocheck/etc but unless the dealership is giving it to you, you'd need to pay for it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
I do work on dealership lots so I have access to their inventory and pricing. Not that it's accurate all the time but it usually is. That's how I was able to get the info that I did in the beginning. I kind of questioned the 9 mile thing to myself in the beginning because it seemed low for the year. A lot of cars come in with 4-9 miles so that would have meant that it didn't move at all. The mileage/listing just wasn't updated after it was originally done.

My car is fine. Runs with no problems. The mileage is getting up there (89k) so my concern is that it will start to develop problems that will cost me money. Then I'd be putting money into a car with that kind of mileage when I could take that same money and get myself into something newer and with a warranty. I do have a car payment. This would bump my car payment up by about $30-50 per month.

It won't hurt to pay for a Carfax to see if there is anything on it. Would there be one if they still list it as new. I'm still wondering if it should be considered new or used.
 

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We bought our 2003 Santa Fe with 7K miles on it and we were the first ones to register it. It was the dealers personal car and we got all the warranties as if it were new. As for jump starting the Hyundai Sonata Hybrid (HSH) I have done it 3 times without a problem because the trunk was left open for days or door ajar.
 

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If this is in way relevant I happened to be driving a "chase" car for a local dealer back from Little Rock the other day; about 62 miles or so. It was a 2011 Sonata SE with 68K on the clock. Other that it didn't have the sunroof or nav it was quite similar mine that only has about 3,500 on the clock.

This is a fact. This car drove like a new one and was completely clean in and out with no dents and could easily be mistaken for a new 2013. By contrast I previously drove a 2012 Altima as a "chase" car with only 25K on the clock. What a piece of crap that car was. To look at it it looked fine but I wouldn't give a dime for it especially with that miserable CVT transmission.

As to the 2011 Sonata if I could buy it for the right price I would happily put it alongside my other SE. That way I wouldn't have to adjust my driving positions and familiarity as I go from vehicle to vehicle. But it is out of warranty and the price as currently asked is more than I'm willing to pay. So it won't happen.

As an aside, I had the pleasure of driving a new Equus back from North Little Rock yesterday. Stickered for $63K. Pretty neat car to put it mildly.

In any event, if a 2011 could be bought for the right price, I would think it should be considered if there is a substantial warranty left on it. My $0.02.
 

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One last thought comes to mind where this 2011 is concerned. If the dealer's service area takes care of their customer's cars as well as they've demonstrated their obvious concern for maintaining their new car inventory, I'd be a little bit leery about taking it there for future service work.

Back to the car in question: Let's say YOU are the dealer and have this "new" 2011 car sitting on your lot. Wouldn't you want to make sure it meets the minimum standards for presentation to a prospective buyer?? Like, um, "starting on demand, and running?" I know the potential exists for lessor demonstrated vehicles' batteries to weaken from sitting inactive for long periods. But if you want to sell a leftover 2011 demo, wouldn't you want it to start, especially since you're paying interest while it sits, unsold?

Lastly, I would think the sales manager would put a "spiff" on this vehicle (additional bonus commission $$$). Now you have the sales force motivated!!! More often than not, EVERY customer arriving at the dealer's lot gets dragged over to see the spiff cars, whether the customer expressed an interest in this particular model, or not. :unsure:
 
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