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YouTube Channel Engineering Explained reached out to Mobile1 to go behind the scenes in their testing to claim 20,000 miles or 1 year on oil.
https://youtu.be/l-zDt9FGJi8
https://youtu.be/l-zDt9FGJi8
Can Engine Oil Be Proven To Last 20,000 Miles?
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976 Posts
Europe seems to go long between oil changes. North America, not so much.
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The problem with this oil is the price, $39 at Walmart for the 5 quart container. The Mobil 1 EP is good for 15,000 miles and costs around $25 without the rebates. Most people put on less than 15,000 miles a year so why pay the extra $14 dollars when the Mobil 1 EP will do the trick!
Of course the other issue is the car under warranty, most still say 7,500 or 1 year and Mobil states to honor the manufacturers recommendation while under warranty.
Any wonder why this oil is staying on the shelves. If the marketing dept drove the development of this oil they should all be fired for not realizing what the consumer is looking for or what constraints they have while under warranty
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I recollect reading somewhere these oils are not moving off the shelves. Until a car is outside of warranty, buying it is a waste of money. Outside of warranty, the Mobil One synthetic and EP can get one a lot of protection for much cheaper. Maybe this oil is aimed for the AMSOIL crowd, and most people going to a WalMart or Advanced Auto are not going to pony that amount of money up for an oil change? Add another $10 bucks for a Mobil oil filter too.
Good luck to anyone switching to this to get 20K OCI out of their turbo after the 100K mark, and reaching 200-250K without issues.
Good luck to anyone switching to this to get 20K OCI out of their turbo after the 100K mark, and reaching 200-250K without issues.
What exactly would the risk be?
This is just another endless discussion/argument on oil life. 10000 threads all over the internet about it.
I had an oil analysis done with Pennzoil Platinum 0w-20 on my old Mazda 3 after 10K miles... results were that there was still lubrication left in the oil... it had not broken down completely and was suggested to try extending the use of the oil to 12K.
Oil is a lubricant, period. It does nothing else other than lubricate engine parts. If, at 10K, the oil is still lubricating properly.. why change it 2500 miles before that?
'Big Oil' loves the old timers that do 3K oil changes like they are still in the 60's. It probably wasn't even needed then either. 7500 is ok, for a lot of people that might be once a year... but nobody should say that longer intervals can't be done or shouldn't be done.
Unless something has changed since the last time I looked into it, Mobil 1 warranties your engine if something happens to it because of the oil. I guess I wouldn't want to try and make a claim under that warranty because good luck proving something one way or another, just like good luck arguing with Hyundai if they claim it's something due to oil changes.
As far as I'm concerned, the only thing that could happen due to your oil change intervals is having no oil in the engine and running it dry... if there's oil in it, there shouldn't be a warranty issue for anything. But that's just me..
This is just another endless discussion/argument on oil life. 10000 threads all over the internet about it.
I had an oil analysis done with Pennzoil Platinum 0w-20 on my old Mazda 3 after 10K miles... results were that there was still lubrication left in the oil... it had not broken down completely and was suggested to try extending the use of the oil to 12K.
Oil is a lubricant, period. It does nothing else other than lubricate engine parts. If, at 10K, the oil is still lubricating properly.. why change it 2500 miles before that?
'Big Oil' loves the old timers that do 3K oil changes like they are still in the 60's. It probably wasn't even needed then either. 7500 is ok, for a lot of people that might be once a year... but nobody should say that longer intervals can't be done or shouldn't be done.
Unless something has changed since the last time I looked into it, Mobil 1 warranties your engine if something happens to it because of the oil. I guess I wouldn't want to try and make a claim under that warranty because good luck proving something one way or another, just like good luck arguing with Hyundai if they claim it's something due to oil changes.
As far as I'm concerned, the only thing that could happen due to your oil change intervals is having no oil in the engine and running it dry... if there's oil in it, there shouldn't be a warranty issue for anything. But that's just me..
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Dealerships and places that change oil also like low mileage intervals. It seems the core service of my dealership is oil changes. From there they can recommend or up sell other profitable services.
Some manufacturers are taking advantage of advancements in motor oil. Toyota is doing 10k/yearly intervals.
Most people I know could care less about oil. I doubt they even check it. A 20k/yearly oil is appropriate for very few people. The people that do extended drain intervals drive a lot of miles, check their oil, and look for bargains.
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You know, oil is one thing that everyone just seems to have a feel for one way or another. My 2008 Azera went 200,000+ miles on 10k OCI and the oil (Pennzoil Platinum 0W20) looked the same coming out as it did going in - every time.
These days with our turbo engines and other high performance features, you just need to use your sense. I am going to be doing 6000 OCI on my new Santa Fe Sport Ultimate 2.0 turbo, and for the first time I will capture a sample for Blackstone analysis. Who knows? The metals might fool me, but I bet a 10k interval (using PP 5W30 now, likely go to PP Euro 5W40 after my warranty period) is going to be just fine. Your mileage WILL vary!
These days with our turbo engines and other high performance features, you just need to use your sense. I am going to be doing 6000 OCI on my new Santa Fe Sport Ultimate 2.0 turbo, and for the first time I will capture a sample for Blackstone analysis. Who knows? The metals might fool me, but I bet a 10k interval (using PP 5W30 now, likely go to PP Euro 5W40 after my warranty period) is going to be just fine. Your mileage WILL vary!
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257 Posts
I will throw my hat in.
Any Turbo - full synthetic only, trust me on this. Dinosaur oil cokes on turbo after shutoff. Syn oil shines at extreme hot or cold.
1) Still in warranty period - change oil according to service interval, with well documented shop, like Dealership, Costco, Firestone...(don't use Jiffy. I don't trust them.) You can change it more frequently, but for sake of warranty, don't go beyond in the belief that Mobil1 will bail you out. They wont. At best they will give you a refund. For warranty claims ,documented records trumps the super oil.
2) Out of warranty - assuming engine is running good, not burning oil and you want to keep the car a long time. DIY or good shop is fine, use synthetic oil and decent (not cheapest fram/Walmart, WIX is good,) filter. Stick with the car manufacturer's recommended interval. Look, the difference in oil price is small compared to the labor cost. If you live in cold regions, synthetic is no-brainer.
If you drive mostly freeway miles, you can extend the miles interval a bit. I've gone over 10Kmi with syn. Stop and go, cold starts, short trips are bad. Most of your wear is at start up.
Needless to say, check oil frequently. No super oil will work if its not there.
Any Turbo - full synthetic only, trust me on this. Dinosaur oil cokes on turbo after shutoff. Syn oil shines at extreme hot or cold.
1) Still in warranty period - change oil according to service interval, with well documented shop, like Dealership, Costco, Firestone...(don't use Jiffy. I don't trust them.) You can change it more frequently, but for sake of warranty, don't go beyond in the belief that Mobil1 will bail you out. They wont. At best they will give you a refund. For warranty claims ,documented records trumps the super oil.
2) Out of warranty - assuming engine is running good, not burning oil and you want to keep the car a long time. DIY or good shop is fine, use synthetic oil and decent (not cheapest fram/Walmart, WIX is good,) filter. Stick with the car manufacturer's recommended interval. Look, the difference in oil price is small compared to the labor cost. If you live in cold regions, synthetic is no-brainer.
If you drive mostly freeway miles, you can extend the miles interval a bit. I've gone over 10Kmi with syn. Stop and go, cold starts, short trips are bad. Most of your wear is at start up.
Needless to say, check oil frequently. No super oil will work if its not there.
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131 Posts
Engine oil has functions apart from lubrication. Oil is used to help cool the engine, clean the engine and help reduce acid build up. Regardless what oil type or brand one uses oil change intervals must not exceed the vehicle manufactures requirements.
Direct injection engines may benefit from more frequent oil changes due to increased by products of combustion that these engines are known for. Using the very best synthetic oil does not permit one to exceed oil change limits under vehicle warranty.
If you have a high performance vehicle or hard worked vehicle then using synthetic oil may be of benefit and may even give one a warm fuzzy feeling but a lighter wallet. Just remember not to exceed oil change limit.
Below is a reply from Hyundai Australia and only relates to owners of 2017 Elantra port injected engines. The petrol question was in relation to Australian premium petrol. Hyundai Australia have given me permission to post this on Hyundai forums.
Customer Care (Hyundai Customer Care)
Dec 6, 12:21 PM AEDT
Dear Robert,
Thank you for contacting Hyundai Customer Care and providing us an opportunity to respond.
In regards to your query we have contacted our National Technical Department and are more than happy to advise the following:
The best practice is to use the same oil brand / type currently in the engine this will have the same additive pack. We recommend purchasing the oil directly off the dealership so it is the same.
However, if you are carrying out an oil change on the vehicle the oil must meet oil specifications listed below (or in the owners handbook) of a viscosity of 10w-30.
The decision between Synthetic, semi synthetic and mineral oil is not relevant as we do not publish or recommend either way. The oil must only meet the required specification. The fuels listed in your email are all ok with no issues.
If you have any other questions please don't hesitate to respond to this email.
Kind regards,
Nikki Jones
Senior Customer Care Officer
Hyundai Motor Company Australia
http://customercare.hyundai.com.au
Phone: 1800 186 306
Direct injection engines may benefit from more frequent oil changes due to increased by products of combustion that these engines are known for. Using the very best synthetic oil does not permit one to exceed oil change limits under vehicle warranty.
If you have a high performance vehicle or hard worked vehicle then using synthetic oil may be of benefit and may even give one a warm fuzzy feeling but a lighter wallet. Just remember not to exceed oil change limit.
Below is a reply from Hyundai Australia and only relates to owners of 2017 Elantra port injected engines. The petrol question was in relation to Australian premium petrol. Hyundai Australia have given me permission to post this on Hyundai forums.
Customer Care (Hyundai Customer Care)
Dec 6, 12:21 PM AEDT
Dear Robert,
Thank you for contacting Hyundai Customer Care and providing us an opportunity to respond.
In regards to your query we have contacted our National Technical Department and are more than happy to advise the following:
The best practice is to use the same oil brand / type currently in the engine this will have the same additive pack. We recommend purchasing the oil directly off the dealership so it is the same.
However, if you are carrying out an oil change on the vehicle the oil must meet oil specifications listed below (or in the owners handbook) of a viscosity of 10w-30.
The decision between Synthetic, semi synthetic and mineral oil is not relevant as we do not publish or recommend either way. The oil must only meet the required specification. The fuels listed in your email are all ok with no issues.
If you have any other questions please don't hesitate to respond to this email.
Kind regards,
Nikki Jones
Senior Customer Care Officer
Hyundai Motor Company Australia
http://customercare.hyundai.com.au
Phone: 1800 186 306
Also the people saying oil changes every 20k miles are just fine are forgetting the filter. While the oil may maintain lubrication, the emulsifiers in the additives pack do however break down allowing sludge to build up. When the filter is no longer able to properly filter the oil "backed up", the bypass valve will allow the oil to completely skip the filter and circulate, unfiltered, through your engine.
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3,837 Posts
Chrysler is the same way, not what kind of oil you are using, but guessing between severe or "normal" driving for the required change interval.
GM is critical on only using dexos approved oils, dealers take advantage of this by charging 40 bucks more than their advertised rates for a "common" oil change, even though when you go to practically any store, dexos only cost a couple of buck more for a five quart bottle, than the conventional or semi-synthetic brands.
Ha, and even at 40 bucks more have no idea what they are pouring in.
Ha, even caught my trusting dealer not replacing the oil filter, wife insisted I get this done, already doing too much already, but back to changing my oil and filter, silicone spraying the suspension rubber bushings, they don't do this either. Don't just peek at the brake pads, make sure they are not dragging, plus everything else, have wear indicators anyway. When I rotate my tires, torqued at exactly 94 ft.-lbs, etc. And I know they are properly rotated.
Ha, changing at before 7,499.9 miles means exactly this, regardless of what kind of oil you use.
GM is critical on only using dexos approved oils, dealers take advantage of this by charging 40 bucks more than their advertised rates for a "common" oil change, even though when you go to practically any store, dexos only cost a couple of buck more for a five quart bottle, than the conventional or semi-synthetic brands.
Ha, and even at 40 bucks more have no idea what they are pouring in.
Ha, even caught my trusting dealer not replacing the oil filter, wife insisted I get this done, already doing too much already, but back to changing my oil and filter, silicone spraying the suspension rubber bushings, they don't do this either. Don't just peek at the brake pads, make sure they are not dragging, plus everything else, have wear indicators anyway. When I rotate my tires, torqued at exactly 94 ft.-lbs, etc. And I know they are properly rotated.
Ha, changing at before 7,499.9 miles means exactly this, regardless of what kind of oil you use.
I'd say if a high percent of your miles are highway the oil could hold up well for 20k miles, some engines with larger sumps like v8 and v6 probably better candidates than turbo 4s with smaller oil capacity.
IMO Hyundai and KIA in the dark ages with respect to their oil maintenance requirements, some have mentioned on here in oil filter discussions for example that the OEM filter is best for no other reason than it is the OEM filter, assuming that Hyundai puts a lot of thought into such things but I'm not so sure.
Their OCI intervals are designed mostly to protect their 10/100 warranty intersts in the US, was discussed some yrs back that Europe and other areas have different oci (longer) intervals.
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1,346 Posts
Thanks for that info! It helps keep things in perspective. We are stuck on 5w-20 oil here in the US. I will be using my 10w-30 conventional oil this summer with confidence after reading your post.
When I update my oil change at My Hyundai it updates the mileage to the next 3,750 for changing the oil. They are telling me what is most important.
Agreed. Regarding OEM filter read this post by Fram's Technical Director Motorking:
https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/u...03/Re:_Premium_Guard_filter_for_H#Post4323203
Motorking said:
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3,837 Posts
Some shop engine specifications:
"Oil pressure (at 1,000rpm) 90.22 kPa (0.92 kgf/cm², 13.09 psi) or above"
"Relief valve opening pressure 500.14 ~ 600.16 kPa (5.10 ~ 6.12 kgf/cm², 72.54 ~ 87.05 psi) (5~6bar)"
"Oil temperature (oil pan): 110±2°C, (230±35.6°F)"
"Oil pressure sensor is a switch, contacts are closed at zero psi, open if the oil pressure exceeds 50 kPa (0.50 kgf/cm², 7.25 psi)."
There is no oil pressure level sensor, that is what the dipstick is for, like mine at the full mark, further verified by measuring the exact amount you are pouring in.
One way Mobile could increase the oil changing interval is by putting less carbon in their fuels, key reason why it gets contaminated. Also builds up on piston rings reducing compression and increasing blowby, adding Seafoam to a tank full of gas helps. And that blowby messes up the vane in the TB, another problem. Another is increased oil consumption.
Carbon builds up on that spark plug center electrode insulator, that shunts the spark voltage directly back to ground. Carbon is also a very good electrical conductor. Humans and other living creatures are subject to death with CO.
Can't believed everything you read on the web.
"Oil pressure (at 1,000rpm) 90.22 kPa (0.92 kgf/cm², 13.09 psi) or above"
"Relief valve opening pressure 500.14 ~ 600.16 kPa (5.10 ~ 6.12 kgf/cm², 72.54 ~ 87.05 psi) (5~6bar)"
"Oil temperature (oil pan): 110±2°C, (230±35.6°F)"
"Oil pressure sensor is a switch, contacts are closed at zero psi, open if the oil pressure exceeds 50 kPa (0.50 kgf/cm², 7.25 psi)."
There is no oil pressure level sensor, that is what the dipstick is for, like mine at the full mark, further verified by measuring the exact amount you are pouring in.
One way Mobile could increase the oil changing interval is by putting less carbon in their fuels, key reason why it gets contaminated. Also builds up on piston rings reducing compression and increasing blowby, adding Seafoam to a tank full of gas helps. And that blowby messes up the vane in the TB, another problem. Another is increased oil consumption.
Carbon builds up on that spark plug center electrode insulator, that shunts the spark voltage directly back to ground. Carbon is also a very good electrical conductor. Humans and other living creatures are subject to death with CO.
Can't believed everything you read on the web.
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257 Posts
June 2017 independent AAA study conclude synthetic oil perform 47% better: (google it)
===============
“Oil protects critical engine components from damage and AAA found that synthetic engine oils performed an average of 47 percent better than conventional oils in a variety of industry-standard tests,” said John Nielsen, AAA’s managing director of Automotive Engineering and Repair. “With its superior resistance to deterioration, AAA’s findings indicate that synthetic oil is particularly beneficial to newer vehicles with turbo-charged engines and for vehicles that frequently drive in stop-and-go traffic, tow heavy loads or operate in extreme hot or cold conditions.”
============= More independent report==(dtsc.ca.org)============
"The two-year study conducted by the State of California examined motor oil longevity in a variety of vehicles, ranging from passenger cars to large diesel engine busses. The 120 vehicles studied accumulated a combined total of nearly 3 million miles. Laboratory analysis of the motor oil tested during use lead to some surprising findings....
The study found that higher quality oils can extend the life of engine oil especially those with higher amounts of additives. Routine oil analysis indicates that many current synthetic oils effectively protect engines from wear with oil change intervals at 15,000 miles."
========High performance car manufacturers recommend synthetic oil=====
BMW, Volkswagen, Mercedes-Benz and Audi recommend synthetic oil for their new cars.
Porsche 911, Chevrolet Corvette recommend Mobil1 synthetic oil.
===========
If you want to extend oil change interval, good quality full syn and high quality filter is the only way to go.
===============
“Oil protects critical engine components from damage and AAA found that synthetic engine oils performed an average of 47 percent better than conventional oils in a variety of industry-standard tests,” said John Nielsen, AAA’s managing director of Automotive Engineering and Repair. “With its superior resistance to deterioration, AAA’s findings indicate that synthetic oil is particularly beneficial to newer vehicles with turbo-charged engines and for vehicles that frequently drive in stop-and-go traffic, tow heavy loads or operate in extreme hot or cold conditions.”
============= More independent report==(dtsc.ca.org)============
"The two-year study conducted by the State of California examined motor oil longevity in a variety of vehicles, ranging from passenger cars to large diesel engine busses. The 120 vehicles studied accumulated a combined total of nearly 3 million miles. Laboratory analysis of the motor oil tested during use lead to some surprising findings....
The study found that higher quality oils can extend the life of engine oil especially those with higher amounts of additives. Routine oil analysis indicates that many current synthetic oils effectively protect engines from wear with oil change intervals at 15,000 miles."
========High performance car manufacturers recommend synthetic oil=====
BMW, Volkswagen, Mercedes-Benz and Audi recommend synthetic oil for their new cars.
Porsche 911, Chevrolet Corvette recommend Mobil1 synthetic oil.
===========
If you want to extend oil change interval, good quality full syn and high quality filter is the only way to go.
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8,479 Posts
It's not the oil that wears out but the additives. Synthetic has fewer additives to start with and is more robust. But the TBN (pH) numbers will drop with use as acid builds up.
You can get a bypass filter set up that will really filter the oil down the sub 5 micron level if you want.
Personally I don't drive enough at about 15k a year on the Accent and only about 6k a year on the Gen Coupe. If I was putting a lot more miles per year I would consider extending the OCI further than it is.
You can get a bypass filter set up that will really filter the oil down the sub 5 micron level if you want.
Personally I don't drive enough at about 15k a year on the Accent and only about 6k a year on the Gen Coupe. If I was putting a lot more miles per year I would consider extending the OCI further than it is.
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