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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hey everyone,

Been a member for a few months but this is my first post. I've done a few searches on Google and in the forums on this topic but can't seem to find anything.

I'm planning on adding a 5 channel amp to my Elantra (2012) and I wanted to replace the battery with one better suited for car audio applications. Has anyone removed their factory battery yet? I haven't attempted to, but I have looked at it under the hood and it seems like its being held down very securely. I just can't seem to find out whats holding it and how to remove it. Just wondering if anyone has any tips for me before I jump in and buy the battery...

Any input would be greatly appreciated!
 

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Anyone using a high output alternator for high output amps? It seems like that is really what's needed since the alternator is providing the amps when the car is running.
 

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Anyone using a high output alternator for high output amps? It seems like that is really what's needed since the alternator is providing the amps when the car is running.
I am not but I was thinking about it when I was having my problems. Would adding a high output amp void any of the warranty?
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
You can download an offline repair manual, save it to your computer and click on the HTML file, go to Electrical, you'll see how to remove the battery.

Elantra - 2013 UD^MD - G 1.8 MPI - 20130522.zip - 26.54 MB

the thread where they talk about it:

http://www.hyundai-forums.com/231-md-2011-elantra/160789-repair-shop-manual-available-offline.html
Thanks so much!

As for the high output alternators, I inquired about this before looking into the battery since it would be the more logical thing to upgrade (battery being second). I went to Mechman Alternators, High Output Alternators, Built in the USA, Call 1-888-MECHMAN! (they specialize in H/O alternators) and had them quote me on how much it would cost for them to custom fabricate one for the Elantra and apparently they can't do it. They did not go into detail as to why, however. There are other companies that make H/O alternators such as www.dcpowerinc.com, however, they don't make any for MD/UD... so we may be out of luck in this field.
 

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You can download an offline repair manual, save it to your computer and click on the HTML file, go to Electrical, you'll see how to remove the battery.
Or you can click here: Hyundai Elantra: Removal - Battery. Repair procedures - Charging System - Engine Electrical System - Hyundai Elantra MD 2010-2014 Service manual

Anyone using a high output alternator for high output amps? It seems like that is really what's needed since the alternator is providing the amps when the car is running.
Hyundai Elantra: Disassembly - Alternator. Repair procedures - Charging System - Engine Electrical System - Hyundai Elantra MD 2010-2014 Service manual

Hyundai uses an over-running alternator decoupler pulley, which I think means the alternator is only active when the car is decelerating, or when it senses a drain and isn't accelerating. Not sure an HO alternator would help unless you disabled that, and not sure you can disable that without it throwing a CEL.

Would adding a high output amp void any of the warranty?
PLEASE CAN WE GET A STICKY ON WARRANTY CLAIMS!!!

  • According to Magnusson-Moss, the car manufacturer cannot deny a warranty claim unless they can SHOW that the failure in question was caused by the warranty.
  • Hyundai has said that using aftermarket oil filters will void the engine warranty as far as they are concerned.

Short answer - it SHOULDN'T affect the warranty, but that's not much consolation what you are spending 6 months to a year in court to get your money back b/c the dealer and the regional manager said that it did.
 

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Hyundai uses an over-running alternator decoupler pulley, which I think means the alternator is only active when the car is decelerating, or when it senses a drain and isn't accelerating. Not sure an HO alternator would help unless you disabled that, and not sure you can disable that without it throwing a CEL.
Wow, that would at first glance seem pretty goofy. But under normal conditions wouldn't it be sensing a drain whenever you are driving the car? So for all intents and purposes it suggests that if you have any accessories/lights on then the alternator is engaged when the vehicle is not accelerating (which is a good deal of driving time), which makes sense in that provides all the engine power to the task at hand. I believe some A/C circuits do that as well.
 

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Hyundai uses an over-running alternator decoupler pulley, which I think means the alternator is only active when the car is decelerating, or when it senses a drain and isn't accelerating.
Got any tech literature on this device ? :confused:

All the engines we pulled out so far to replace pistons and rings appeared to have plain old fashion pulley nutted onto end of alternator shaft.. guts rotated with pulley rotation.

Might have a look at the ETM - charging system for chrage system control source. :)
 

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Hyundai uses an over-running alternator decoupler pulley, which I think means the alternator is only active when the car is decelerating, or when it senses a drain and isn't accelerating. Not sure an HO alternator would help unless you disabled that, and not sure you can disable that without it throwing a CEL.

Don't know about the "decoupler pulley " but the description is correct.

Description

The charging system included a battery, an alternator with a built-in regulator, and the charging indicator light and wire.
The Alternator has eight built-in diodes, each rectifying AC current to DC current.

Therefore, DC current appears at alternator "B" terminal.
In addition, the charging voltage of this alternator is regulated by the battery voltage detection system.

The alternator is regulated by the battery voltage detection system. The main components of the alternator are the rotor, stator, rectifier, capacitor brushes, bearings and V-ribbed belt pulley. The brush holder contains a built-in electronic voltage regulator.

Alternator Management System

Alternator management system controls the charging voltage set point in order to improve fuel economy, manage alternator load under various operating conditions, keep the battery charged, and protect the battery from over-charging.

ECM controls generating voltage by duty cycle (charging control, discharging control, normal control) based on the battery conditions and vehicle operating conditions.

The system conducts discharging control when accelerating a vehicle. Vehicle reduces an alternator load and consumes an electric power form a battery.

The system conducts charging control when decelerating a vehicle. Vehicle increases an alternator load and charges a battery.

Hyundai Elantra: Description and Operation - Charging System - Engine Electrical System - Hyundai Elantra MD 2010-2014 Service manual
 

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I replaced my battery with a higher output type. It's the factory specified replacement but wider in dimension. Fits fine with minor mod to the battery heat shield.

Just wondering, what would happen if you replaced the pulley with one mentioned by srb711. I've heard of people doing this with no problems. Plus it'll get rid or the decoupler which in itself can go bad.
 

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Evolution of Alternator Pulleys

http://www.gates.com/common/downloads/files/australia/brochure/ADP_brochure.pdf

The Overrunning Alternator Decoupler Pulley (OAD)
Not only has a one-way clutch inside, it also incorporates a torsion spring to absorb energy.
The effects of the internal clutch are the same as mentioned above; however, the patented
internal torsion spring design is the key to the much higher level of function associated
with the OAD. The internal spring is tuned (engine specific) to absorb base engine
vibrations (cylinder firing pulses) before they reach the alternator rotor and
negatively affect the accessory drive. With the OAD installed you will see
much less tensioner motion, reduced noise, vibration, and harshness and
an all around more robust accessory drive.
*

 

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I never knew exactly how the OAD worked - perhaps you could just remove it for a standard pulley - put expect warranty denial when your motor mounts wore out.

You could also probably add a second alternator in addition to the stock one, but now you are talking about custom brackets, custom belts and routing, etc.

As far as warranty with any of this:

It's not something I would be comfortable upgrading if warranty concerns were an issue to me. Let me give you a hypothetical.

Let's say your car gets a fried ECM, and this is probably a $1100 part (ECM for 2011 Hyundai Elantra|39101-2EMB0
  • Let's say the fried ECM is caused by poor voltage regulation in the OEM Hyundai alternator - not much question - Hyundai replaces the ECM under warranty, perhaps several times before they also replace the alternator and the ECM.
  • OTOH, let's say the fried ECM is caused by poor voltage regulation on the replacement HO alternator. Not much question, you (the owner) should be liable for the replacement of the HO alternator (unless it has a warranty), the ECM (unless the HO warranty covers consequential damages), and diagnostic charges for Hyundai determining the alternator caused the problem.
  • Now, if the HO alternator was working correctly, but the ECM fried, Hyundai should warranty the ECM, but ... Hyundai has no way of knowing if the alternator had an intermittent fault and has a financial incentive to say it did (and quite likely would be correct), whereas you have a financial incentive to say the alternator had nothing to do with it (and might be correct), but have no realistic way to prove the alternator DIDN'T cause the failure. (And if it comes down to it, Hyundai can afford more expensive lawyers than you can, but might not force the issue b/c of bad PR and lost future sales.)
 

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You could also probably add a second alternator in addition to the stock one, but now you are talking about custom brackets, custom belts and routing, etc.
Much easier to replace with an OEM 120amp ISG type alternator and may work correctly with the correct battery voltage detection system and an ECM update???
 

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added to my favorites, thanks.
I suddenly had this look of terror on my face as I thought: "Has this been Wal-Mart-proofed and tested?"

That thought is probably just borrowing more trouble than is warranted. But I'll do like always if the battery goes out: change it, myself! I'm secure in my quality of workmanship.
 

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one solution would be to mount a couple of capacitors and the amp onto some kind of easily removable mount in the trunk. The caps would be able to handle the current draw fluctuations, negating the need for the new alternator. And mounting and hiding the wiring properly would make it darn near impossible for anyone to know they were there unless they went looking for them. There are always way to get things back to stock if warranty needs arise while under warranty. Just a matter of how much work you wanna do to get things back to stock IMHO.
 

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I suddenly had this look of terror on my face as I thought: "Has this been Wal-Mart-proofed and tested?"

That thought is probably just borrowing more trouble than is warranted. But I'll do like always if the battery goes out: change it, myself! I'm secure in my quality of workmanship.
what did I do?
 

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what did I do?
Nothing, LOL. After reading the removal instructions that you posted, I began thinking of some 17-year old kid at Wal-Mart changing my battery and it conjured up all kinds of bad scenarios in my head.

We've all heard the horror stories of untightened oil drain plugs. What if he doesn't pay attention and installs the cables on the wrong posts, if only for a brief second? If I saw that done to Ingrid, they'd have to place the battery charger paddles onto my chest to revive me! :eek:
 

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Not sure what Okie Rich is talking about, the link was basically the same info as posted previously at Hyundai Tech Info, when it was free.

@Xion - you're welcome, but I can't take the credit - another member posted it in the Avante folding mirrors and puddle lights thread - I just bookmarked it as well.

Much easier to replace with an OEM 120amp ISG type alternator and may work correctly with the correct battery voltage detection system and an ECM update???
Exactly how do you update the ECM? I assume the code is encrypted. Someone like Diablo Tune MIGHT be working on a performance tune for the Elantra, but I doubt they are working on an OAD notification delete section of the coding.

(Now perhaps just putting a standard pulley on the alternator will NOT set a CEL - I'd be interested in finding that out, but probably not with my Elantra even if I had one!!!)
 
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