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The year was 2009 and I was working for Toyota. I bought a used 2007 Prius 4 with 44k miles on it. I kept that car for 4.5 years, I almost had it paid off when the AC blew. In lew of fixing it, I decided to trade the car in for a Santa Fe Turbo Sport.

Driving the Prius was a cycle of letting the battery charge and then feathering the accelerator to get at best 45 MPG. The ride on the 15-inch wheels was lousy. The interior panels did not align. As you went down the road things would rattle and shake like a model-T.

While the Ionic is still a somewhat confusing process of letting the battery charge and feathering the accelerator. However, I have only had it for a bit over 150 miles of driving, I am still unsure about how to make EV mode kick on when I want it. I will say that the panels are aligned well, there are no shakes or rattles. The road noise is even kept to a minimum.

Does anyone have any tips on making the Ioniq stay in EV mode as long as possible? I commute on roads where the speed limit is 35-45 MPH. I am found a road I can take to work where the speed limit is 35 MPH for a greater distance and I have seen my MPG go up 2-2.5 MPG in the two days I have been using this road. I have also been blessed with low 70 degree outdoor temps and have not had a real need to use the AC. This might have contributed to the continual increase in the MPG. Cracking the windows and sunroof have provided enough cool air here in Florida.

For the last 90 miles or so I am getting 60.5-60.8 MPG according to the on-board computer. How accurate has that been for you?

Who else really loves LKA? I think it is freaky but it is almost as cool as the smart cruise control.
 

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Congrat friend. Ioniq (and Kona) are good choices.
Ioniq got rid of the 12v lead acid boat anchor battery, way to go!
Prius is a fine purpose built mileage champ but it needs some competition.
Join the 99.9 MPGe club. Sometimes I intentionally take the county road just to *hypermile* at 45 mph. Air resistance goes up at velocity squared.
 

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We have had our Ioniq for a year now. Still gets 56 - 57 mpg (according to computer) we don't baby it either - Highway at 75 will drop to 52-53 mpg. I can live with that - Have done the very easy - slow - back roads just to see what I could get and was over 60 mpg. We do live in East Central Illinois so hills are pretty much non-existent. Love how when you need to pass on a two lane road - when both the electric and gas are kicked in - fastest passing car I have owned since gas guzzling V8's of the 60's. From 55 - 80 in a second or two - awesome!
 

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I couldn't resist to reply to this because I've been driving Prii since 2005. I actually still have a Prius 2007 with almost 150K miles, another Prius (2015; my daughter drives it now).
Knock on wood (or hood :)), we have not major issues yet with our 2007.
However, I have replaced our Prius 2005 with an Ioniq 2018 - not with Prius Prime because I decided that Hyundai made better design decisions. CarPlay, full size backseat, better warranty (although it is possible Prius hybrid technology is better just because it has been around for longer).
I like LKA. I tried the smart cruise control. It's clearly much better than the old "regular" cruise control, but I don't know yet how much I will use it. I don't drive that much on a highway, and we have not taken a long trip yet in Ioniq.
Our typical daily commute is between 28-70 miles.
When it was cold, the moment we turn on the heat, it starts the gasoline engine. Weird. I don't think it uses too much gasoline, but it does change the gas consumption.
I am very happy with using just the battery. When the outside temperature is between 55-75F, I often get more miles than the onboard computer estimates. The same is true for the gasoline engine, but I need a longer trip to see the actual hybrid gas mileage. I expect it to be around 50 mpg, but I wasn't driving with an empty battery that much to say it for sure that it won't drop lower.
To compare, our Prius 2015 (not a plugin) gives us 55-60 in very good conditions without an a/c, and drops to 40-45mpg in unfavorable conditions. I am yet to discover what Ioniq will do in those conditions without the battery.
I also expect to go lower when we start using a/c.
 

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I couldn't resist to reply to this because I've been driving Prii since 2005. I actually still have a Prius 2007 with almost 150K miles, another Prius (2015; my daughter drives it now).
Knock on wood (or hood :)), we have not major issues yet with our 2007.
However, I have replaced our Prius 2005 with an Ioniq 2018 - not with Prius Prime because I decided that Hyundai made better design decisions. CarPlay, full size backseat, better warranty (although it is possible Prius hybrid technology is better just because it has been around for longer).
I like LKA. I tried the smart cruise control. It's clearly much better than the old "regular" cruise control, but I don't know yet how much I will use it. I don't drive that much on a highway, and we have not taken a long trip yet in Ioniq.
Our typical daily commute is between 28-70 miles.
When it was cold, the moment we turn on the heat, it starts the gasoline engine. Weird. I don't think it uses too much gasoline, but it does change the gas consumption.
I am very happy with using just the battery. When the outside temperature is between 55-75F, I often get more miles than the onboard computer estimates. The same is true for the gasoline engine, but I need a longer trip to see the actual hybrid gas mileage. I expect it to be around 50 mpg, but I wasn't driving with an empty battery that much to say it for sure that it won't drop lower.
To compare, our Prius 2015 (not a plugin) gives us 55-60 in very good conditions without an a/c, and drops to 40-45mpg in unfavorable conditions. I am yet to discover what Ioniq will do in those conditions without the battery.
I also expect to go lower when we start using a/c.
Hyundai does not put Electric heaters in their hybrids, it uses the heat from the engine like a conventional car. Because of this, if you turn the heater on before the engine is up to temperature, it will start the engine -- and it will restart as the engine cools down.

I'm not sure of Hyundai's exact reasoning, though I suspect it is at least partially a matter of how much range you lose with an electric heater or heat pump; and also the fact that their PHEVs are largely designed for California.
 

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Hyundai does not put Electric heaters in their hybrids, it uses the heat from the engine like a conventional car. Because of this, if you turn the heater on before the engine is up to temperature, it will start the engine -- and it will restart as the engine cools down.

I'm not sure of Hyundai's exact reasoning, though I suspect it is at least partially a matter of how much range you lose with an electric heater or heat pump; and also the fact that their PHEVs are largely designed for California.
All PHEV will run gas engine in cold weather for heat to ensure the gas engine does not get "short run time" which will kill the engine oil and then the engine. To get a few dollars fuel savings at the expense of accelerated engine wear would be stupid.

Actually, heat pumps are ideal for mild climates like CA to Washington states. Up north in Canada, winters are too cold and HPs work like s*&t. Imagine trying to transfer heat from outside air of -20F to inside air of 35F. Not much heating is going to happen. Cars (and houses) with HP must have an auxiliary electric heat element for this reason.
 

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All PHEV will run gas engine in cold weather for heat to ensure the gas engine does not get "short run time" which will kill the engine oil and then the engine. To get a few dollars fuel savings at the expense of accelerated engine wear would be stupid.

Actually, heat pumps are ideal for mild climates like CA to Washington states. Up north in Canada, winters are too cold and HPs work like s*&t. Imagine trying to transfer heat from outside air of -20F to inside air of 35F. Not much heating is going to happen. Cars (and houses) with HP must have an auxiliary electric heat element for this reason.
Actually, most PHEVs I know of have electric heaters (or heat pumps) and, so long as you remain in EV, don't start the engine -- they run like an EV, though their range will be maybe half of normal. Since the engine never comes on there is no effect on the engine oil (just like not running the car at all). Hyundai seems to be an exception here.

Now, most PHEVs will require a certain amount of run time if the engine is never used; if the engine isn't started for a certain period of time the car will switch itself out of EV mode to hybrid mode. Much of that is to prevent the gasoline from sitting in the gas tank to long, as it will eventually gel; though it also allows the oil to lubricate the engine parts. And, of course, you must change your oil at the same interval as an HEV to lubricate the engine and ensure the engine remains "good."
 

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Chevy Volt, the most popular PHEV's heating mode is similar, run gas engine when heating mode: ( From Volt manual)

"Automatic Climate Control System: The heating, cooling, and ventilation for the vehicle can be controlled with this system. The vehicle may require the use of an auxiliary heat source under certain cold conditions. This provides additional heating and defrost capability obtained by running the engine, even if the high voltage battery is adequately charged. Under these conditions, the engine will start and use fuel. Make sure there is fuel in the tank."

Honda Clarity PHEV forum:
"A battery heating system is not included in the US model. Result: Will not start in battery temperatures below -22F, and engine must run in temperatures below 14F (not sure if that’s also due to lack of a battery heater). Not the most encouraging setup up north in the winter. Canadian models get a battery heater, which I’m assuming will help the need for the engine to run."

Analysis of Prius Prime plug in heat pump rationale:
"Stepping back, one has to ask: Why is Toyota going to all this additional complexity for a low AER plug in vehicle that has a gasoline engine? There’s plenty of waste heat available from the engine. This complex of a system would be better suited for a pure BEV in our opinion. Perhaps Toyota DOES have a secret BEV project waiting in the wings and the Mirai is just a ruse!
Given that this system would be better suited for a pure BEV, do you think this would be a worthwhile option for the Tesla model 3 or Bolt EV?
— or does Tesla have a better way by simply using waste heat to warm things up?"
Advanced Heat Pump Comes of Age in the New Prius Prime. Would this be a good option for Model 3 or the Bolt EV? - GM-VOLT : Chevy Volt Electric Car Site GM-VOLT : Chevy Volt Electric Car Site

Even the newest Tesla Model 3 does not incorporate a heat pump, tells you they don't work well for cars that are include markets with extreme cold winters.
In fact no Tesla uses a heat pump.
Chevy Bolt, popular full electric EV does not use a heat pump.
The real reason is range. The Leaf has inadequate range when artic cold saps range to 50%.
Bolt and Tesla still has adequate range, even when winter cuts range is in half.
Every heat pump manufacturer will tell you must use auxiliary electric heat when below around 10F.
For a plug in with gasoline engine, there is abundant waste heat, 70% of spent gasoline is rejected heat.
For every plug in, the gas engine is the heavy lifter in terms of propulsion, so as soon as you hit that gas pedal a wee bit hard the gas engine fires up.
The mindset should be that PHEVs are hybrid with a larger battery. The electric drive is there to assist and recapture regen energy.
If one wants to run electric only mode all the time - that is really "hypermiling" mode.
Compare the weight to EV-motor hp ratio of any PHEV, it would be obvious that car designers never intend the car to be driven in EV mode only.
I am not* saying heat pumps are not good, they are efficient. A PHEV is very complex already, adding another complex subsystem that must still have an backup electric heater and a convoluted defrost (window defrost and heat exchanger defrost) cycle to get a bit more MPG?
 

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Chevy Volt, the most popular PHEV's heating mode is similar, run gas engine when heating mode: ( From Volt manual)

"Automatic Climate Control System: The heating, cooling, and ventilation for the vehicle can be controlled with this system. The vehicle may require the use of an auxiliary heat source under certain cold conditions. This provides additional heating and defrost capability obtained by running the engine, even if the high voltage battery is adequately charged. Under these conditions, the engine will start and use fuel. Make sure there is fuel in the tank."
Let us be honest here, the Volt has a resistive electric heater. Yes, for when there are extremely cold temperatures -- from what I read, sub-zero -- it will use the gasoline engine to help. But in most conditions it will not turn on the gasoline engine.

Honda Clarity PHEV forum:
"A battery heating system is not included in the US model. Result: Will not start in battery temperatures below -22F, and engine must run in temperatures below 14F (not sure if that’s also due to lack of a battery heater). Not the most encouraging setup up north in the winter. Canadian models get a battery heater, which I’m assuming will help the need for the engine to run."
Not applicable to what we are talking about here -- mostly. The part you've quoted is talking about a heater for the battery -- not the climate control. Of course, as you likely know, the Clarity has a heat pump.

Analysis of Prius Prime plug in heat pump rationale:
"Stepping back, one has to ask: Why is Toyota going to all this additional complexity for a low AER plug in vehicle that has a gasoline engine? There’s plenty of waste heat available from the engine. This complex of a system would be better suited for a pure BEV in our opinion. Perhaps Toyota DOES have a secret BEV project waiting in the wings and the Mirai is just a ruse!
Given that this system would be better suited for a pure BEV, do you think this would be a worthwhile option for the Tesla model 3 or Bolt EV?
— or does Tesla have a better way by simply using waste heat to warm things up?"
Advanced Heat Pump Comes of Age in the New Prius Prime. Would this be a good option for Model 3 or the Bolt EV? - GM-VOLT : Chevy Volt Electric Car Site GM-VOLT : Chevy Volt Electric Car Site

Even the newest Tesla Model 3 does not incorporate a heat pump, tells you they don't work well for cars that are include markets with extreme cold winters.
In fact no Tesla uses a heat pump.
Chevy Bolt, popular full electric EV does not use a heat pump.
The real reason is range. The Leaf has inadequate range when artic cold saps range to 50%.
Bolt and Tesla still has adequate range, even when winter cuts range is in half.
Every heat pump manufacturer will tell you must use auxiliary electric heat when below around 10F.
And there is nothing in the above but opinion, and the fact that the heat pump doesn't work well by itself in extreme cold temperatures (which we had already established).

For a plug in with gasoline engine, there is abundant waste heat, 70% of spent gasoline is rejected heat.

For every plug in, the gas engine is the heavy lifter in terms of propulsion, so as soon as you hit that gas pedal a wee bit hard the gas engine fires up.
Actually, this is not true, at least for some of the PHEVs; many you do have to manually shut off. The last I knew, the Ford PHEVs, would stay in EV mode until either the battery is "discharged" or it is manually turned off. Yes, the electric motor is smaller (though it has plenty of torque) and it can be somewhat anemic at higher speeds -- but then most people aren't buying a PHEV to drive in EV on a freeway (at least if they've done any research). The Honda's are a bit of a different case, as they tend to only use EV mode at lower speeds and use the gasoline engine largely as a power plant. I haven't researched enough on the current Honda system, but I believe it is another that does not slip out of EV mode easily.

The mindset should be that PHEVs are hybrid with a larger battery. The electric drive is there to assist and recapture regen energy.
If one wants to run electric only mode all the time - that is really "hypermiling" mode.
Compare the weight to EV-motor hp ratio of any PHEV, it would be obvious that car designers never intend the car to be driven in EV mode only.
I am not* saying heat pumps are not good, they are efficient. A PHEV is very complex already, adding another complex subsystem that must still have an backup electric heater and a convoluted defrost (window defrost and heat exchanger defrost) cycle to get a bit more MPG?
Again, it is not me that has claimed that the Sonata and Ioniq PHEVs should have a resistive heater or heat pump, that is the opinion of many PHEV owners on the board; some saying if they had realized their car did not have an electric heater, they would have bought a different PHEV. While they can be underpowered in EV mode, they do have plenty of torque and are typically no worse than some underpowered gasoline cars.

Let's look at what is typically more of a real life use case of a PHEV -- say someone that drives 10 miles to work daily and/or runs errands (such as shopping) in the area within a few miles of home. But the, occasionally, they want to take their car on a trip, maybe to see family that is 300 miles or so away. For these people, with short daily trips, a hybrid ends up being little better than a gas powered car -- particularly in the winter -- when on shorter trips the engine will be on for much of their drive (to bring fluids up to temperature and heat the cabin). In fact, in some cases, because of the weight of the battery and motor it is even worse than a conventional car.

For these people, a PHEV is ideal. For their daily commute they can typically stay in EV mode for the entire commute, or errand run. So having a heat pump/resistive heater can be huge for them -- it allows them to stay in EV mode during (at least most of) the winter; as opposed to having a car that is likely even worse than a conventional gas car. This is doubly true considering many can turn the car on while still connected to power and heat the cabin before leaving -- and still have most of the range on their car. This doesn't work if they car has no electric heater, as the car must be removed from the garage -- not to mention you will be using gasoline to preheat the car. Worse, without the electric heater, if the temperature is only about 60 degrees the engine will likely start if the climate control is on. So that cool September (or even late May) morning they will be using the gas engine instead of using their car as an EV.

I think the issue you, and some of your linked editorial writers, have is that you are trying to fit PHEV owners into the way you would use your car. Obviously, a PHEV is not for everyone -- for that matter, there are people who are not good candidates for a hybrid (such as drivers who primarily drive on freeways). There are many (maybe even most) that buy PHEVs because they want an EV for daily use and a more conventional (or hybrid) car for weekends, but don't want two different cars. For these drivers, they almost all want some type of electric heater that (in most conditions) can heat the cabin. And, as we've established, pretty much every PHEV other than Hyundai/Kia do have some type of electric heating system for the climate control.
 

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It is not an opinion at all, frequent cold weather starts will kill an gas engine.
Starting engines in cold weather | The Chronicle Herald
"Most engine wear occurs in the first couple minutes after a cold start. Rich fuel mixtures wash lubrication from the cylinder walls.
Thick oil doesn’t spray onto moving parts as easily, so using a winter grade oil will help reduce engine wear.
When the engine is first started, the oil pump forces oil into the oil passages and through the oil filter.
The pleated filter element may restrict thick oil too much, so a bypass valve is designed into either the oil filter or the engine itself so the thick oil can bypass the filter.
Oil may bypass the filter for only a few seconds or for nearly a minute if temperatures are cold and the oil viscosity is high.
During this time, unfiltered oil flows to the engine, which is better than no oil, but it still allows dirt particles to flow to moving parts.
Vehicles subjected to Canada’s cold winter starts experience more engine wear in a couple years than a California vehicle may in a couple decades of starts."

This is the reason USA has the 10y/100, Canada gets 5y/62 powertrain warranty.
I think there is nothing dishonest about pointing out that Hyundai would not allow their PHEV cars to short run the gas engine in cold weather. The implementation - cold weather being when one needs cabin heat. They do that by keeping the engine running for sufficient time when you turn on the heat. I cannot imagine any PHEV maker would want you to cold start the gas engine multiple times, as needed then shut off after a couple of minutes. (As in passing, hill climb, freeway merge...) Each time a cold engine start since the engine would never get up to temperatures. Rinse and repeat. I shudder to think doing that to my engine.

It isn't what people want, it is what scenario will lead to costly and damning warranty repair costs. e.g. engine replacements.
People are not going say, I ruined the engine. They will say the engine is a piece of crap, didn't last half as long as my last car.

 

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It is not an opinion at all, frequent cold weather starts will kill an gas engine.
Starting engines in cold weather | The Chronicle Herald
"Most engine wear occurs in the first couple minutes after a cold start. Rich fuel mixtures wash lubrication from the cylinder walls.
Thick oil doesn’t spray onto moving parts as easily, so using a winter grade oil will help reduce engine wear.
When the engine is first started, the oil pump forces oil into the oil passages and through the oil filter.
The pleated filter element may restrict thick oil too much, so a bypass valve is designed into either the oil filter or the engine itself so the thick oil can bypass the filter.
Oil may bypass the filter for only a few seconds or for nearly a minute if temperatures are cold and the oil viscosity is high.
During this time, unfiltered oil flows to the engine, which is better than no oil, but it still allows dirt particles to flow to moving parts.
Vehicles subjected to Canada’s cold winter starts experience more engine wear in a couple years than a California vehicle may in a couple decades of starts."

This is the reason USA has the 10y/100, Canada gets 5y/62 powertrain warranty.
I think there is nothing dishonest about pointing out that Hyundai would not allow their PHEV cars to short run the gas engine in cold weather. The implementation - cold weather being when one needs cabin heat. They do that by keeping the engine running for sufficient time when you turn on the heat. I cannot imagine any PHEV maker would want you to cold start the gas engine multiple times, as needed then shut off after a couple of minutes. (As in passing, hill climb, freeway merge...) Each time a cold engine start since the engine would never get up to temperatures. Rinse and repeat. I shudder to think doing that to my engine.

It isn't what people want, it is what scenario will lead to costly and damning warranty repair costs. e.g. engine replacements.
People are not going say, I ruined the engine. They will say the engine is a piece of crap, didn't last half as long as my last car.

Then you are misunderstanding. What I'm saying is that most manufacturers give the electric heater to try and prevent the gas engine from turning on at all -- for how these people use these cars on a daily basis. Now, with these cars with an electric heater, if the engine turns on it will still stay on until it is up to operating temperature -- it isn't going to turn on for a few seconds and then turn off; so they operate the same way (if the engine turns on at all) as the Hyundai PHEVs.

The goal is for these short cold weather trips to not have the engine turn on at all, that is the reason for having the electric heater.
 

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Ok, I agree to see your perspective. You must live in the country to pull that off. I live in medium sized city, people will literally run me over if I don at least keep up with flow. Once on the interstate, where I do 90 % of driving, I can cruise in EV mode at 65mph. I also work evenings, avoiding truly road-rage commuters. ?
 

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Ok, I agree to see your perspective. You must live in the country to pull that off. I live in medium sized city, people will literally run me over if I don at least keep up with flow. Once on the interstate, where I do 90 % of driving, I can cruise in EV mode at 65mph. I also work evenings, avoiding truly road-rage commuters. ?
Again, I don't have a PHEV, this doesn't apply to me. I've thought about it, I could make a PHEV work much of the time for me despite living in the suburbs of one of the largest US cities; though at least half the time I'd likely be using the car in Hybrid mode. Don't misunderstand me, I fully understand what you are saying -- I live half a mile from a seven-lane road with a 50 mph speed limit.

As for acceleration; from what I've seen, and the way I currently accelerate with my hybrid, I likely wouldn't have any more issue with driving in EV mode than I do trying to accelerate driving my hybrid for best fuel economy -- again, the exceptions being the taking freeway on ramps when I wouldn't be using EV mode anyway; especially considering that the electric motor is larger on the PHEVs -- and larger still on other manufacturers PHEVs.

The people PHEVs largely work for are those that don't need a freeway or highway for their commute. These can be people in smaller cities, people who live in urban areas, and even people in the suburbs where their work is also located in the suburbs. It typically doesn't matter where people live, it is more where they need to travel and the roads they will be taking to get there.

I frequently watch car reviews by Alex on Autos on YouTube; and to some degree I agree with his thought that there are two categories of PHEVs. The first category would be an EV with a range extender -- the BMW i3 is clearly in this category, and the Chevy Volt also tends to fit here. Both are designed to be used in EV mode, with a powerful enough motor and large battery. The Hyundai PHEVs are more, as what you are talking about, a hybrid with a larger battery. Again, for the right people they can still work very well, but most people (as you point out) would be using them as more as a hybrid vehicle.
 

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Having driven a 2nd (2005) and 3rd (2010) gen Prius for the last 13 years, we were in the market for a new Prius when our '05 traction battery went t_ts up in March. Couldn't stomach the interior and exterior appearance of the Prius in person, so we went across the street to the Hyundai dealer. Loved the Ioniq and bought it on the spot (2018 Hybrid Limited). So far, the car gets better gas mileage than out two Toyotas but is very slightly less refined (engine noise and ride). On balance, though, I'd buy it over the Prius again in a New York minute!
 
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