Dave,

I just bought a used 2007 Entourage with 22K miles about a month ago. That noise you were referring to was my first observation the first time we started the engine after sitting overnight and everytime I start that vehicle. It drives me crazy because I am afraid that damage is occuring at each start.

I just came across this group today on a Google search and this was the only forum discussion trail that I have read and wanted to thank you for your diligence and sharing your experience with others.

My first attempt was going to try and use a synthetic oil and see if this improved. As it looks there is no known cause at this point and time will tell and hopefully the warranty will be available if issues arise.

Kevin

Hey Guys...

I found this on the alldata website:

06-20-002 OCT 06 Engine - Timing Chain Noise On Initial Start Up

It is a TSB (Technical Service Bulletin) that ALL dealers get. I am going to pay for the service at alldata and post more details about this TSB.

Here it is guys, not much info but I plan to print it out and take it back to the dealer...

Engine - Timing Chain Noise On Initial Start Up

Group: ENGINE MECHANICAL

Number: 06-20-002

Date: OCTOBER, 2006

Model: 2006-07MY 3.3L & 3.8L AZERA,
ENTOURAGE, SANTA FE, SONATA

Subject
3.3L & 3.8L TIMING CHAIN TENSIONER - PART
UPDATE

DESCRIPTION:
An updated timing chain tensioner is now available. This part may help reduce timing chain noise that may affect some vehicles during the initial 10 seconds of operation after prolonged storage.

VEHICLES AFFECTED:

^ Model:

^ 2006-07 Azera 3.8L - Produced through July 4, 2006

^ 2007 Entourage 3.8L - Produced through June 26, 2006

^ 2007 Santa Fe 3.3L - Produced through August 4, 2006

^ 2006-07 Sonata 3.3L - Produced through August 4, 2006







PARTS INFORMATION:

For the good of the group this morning I looked at my RPM at startup. It went to a fast idle of about 2200-2300 for a few seconds and then settled to about 1500. The temp was in the low 40's.

Here is the latest TSB........





This post has been edited by timk22: Apr 24 2008, 08:44 PM

Attached File(s)
 timing_chain_tensioner_replacement.pdf ( 1.13mb ) Number of downloads: 38

Unfortunately, I am also a sad owner of a 2007 Entourage 3.8L, purchased 6-29-07. This engine, as well as other hyundai paper filter engines, definitely has a design flaw. At cold start up, the engine will tap for 4 - 5 seconds because all the oil drains out of engine after about 4 hours.

My van has been back to the dealer 5 times for this issue, so I have been eagerly following this website for information. This is a brief history of my experience and the findings. 1st visit - they said they didn't hear anything. 2nd visit they heard the noise and tech support had them change oil filter and oil to 5W20 and checked electric throttle actuator. 3rd visit - they confirmed the noise and replaced timing chain tensioner. 4th visit it becomes interesting - They began using my vehicle as an experiment. Hyundai had them check for carbon in the cylinder. So they soaked the cylinders down with a cleaner and then tested for noise the next day.

After the cylinders were cleaned and it still made the same noise, Hyundai had the service guys test the internal oil pressure, and per the oil pressure gauge, the engine had not oil pressure for 4 to 5 seconds. Hyundai then had the service guys completely tear the engine apart to check for internal premature engine wear. When they first tore the engine apart they tried to sweep it under the carpet and said that there was minimal wear. So I simply told them to leave the engine apart and I would have another mechanic come and verify what they were saying. They changed their mind and called me back and said that they were going to do a complete engine replacement (long block). Hyundai (corporate) had them take pictures of the torn down engine for their study.

5th visit for this issue - They verified that that there was no oil pressure for 2 - 3 seconds (warmer weather now and quicker to warm up engine). The service guys watched the oil drain down when shut off. Hyundai (corporate) had them change the oil and filter 2 times - 5W20 then 10W30. Still no improvement. I asked about them designing a retrofit part to change the oil filter design and to include an oil check valve so that the oil would not completely drain out of the engine. No luck!

Final Corporate decision: It is a design of the vehicle and they are not going to do anything at this time.

My suggestion to all Hyundai owners. Listen to your engine at start up. If it is making a tapping noise (like it does on initial start-up after an oil change), take it back to your dealer. There is premature wear going on in your engine. After, the dealer bows out and says, "considered normal for type of engine in vehicle", compain to your state's attorney general and consider filing a complaint with the Office of Defects Investigation (ODI) www-odi.nhtsa.gov/ivoq/Consumer.cfm

I personally plan on filing complaints with Indiana's Attorney General, ODI, and the Federal Trade Commission. Hyundai has brought an inferior untested product into our country and refuses to fix their engineering design flaw.

Oh by the way, the local Hyundai dealership offered me a whopping $16,500 trade in allowance for my vehicle with about 8,000 miles on it (over $11,000 less than purchase price). But I guess I will keep it for 10 years. I wonder how many engines will have to be replaced?

Even though I don't own an Entourage I have been following this post. Hyundai should own up to the fact that there is a design flaw with the Entourage and fix it. One good thing is you have that warranty and while it may be a hassle to keep taking it back, atleast it is there. What about the lemon law? I am sure you more than qualify for it.
Does anyone know if the Sedona's are having this problem as well since they are same vehicle?

This post has been edited by HyundaiLvr87: May 31 2008, 07:56 AM

After I posted on this site, I called Hyundai Corporate Headquarters and they are to investigate the issue. They have until Wednesday to resolve my issue (I told them I would like a buy back). They know that if I have not heard from them by Thursday, I am proceeding with Indiana lemon laws.

Unfortunately, this problem is not confined to the entourage only. The loaner car that they gave us to use was a sonata. It also had the same problem. And all the new vehicles on their lot seem to have the same noise to different degrees. The problem seems to be with their new cost cutting design using paper oil filters rather than spin on filters. Possibly the engineers failed to include an oil check valve in the proper place to stop the oil from draining out of the engine. The hyundai service department did not even know if there was an oil check valve in the engine.

Hyundai does need to own up to the problem and design a retro-fit part to stop the oil from draining out of the engines. This is an expensive problem that the consumers should not have to deal with. Even with Hyundai's 10 year warranty, the consumers will suffer when they attempt any type of trade-in, and the consumers are left with the aggravation of constantly getting their vehicles
repaired.

Hyundai's failure to design a retro-fit part to correct the engine oil lubrication problem could possibly end up costing American consumers big bucks.

Interesting thread, I have a 2008 Veracruz with the 3.8l, fine so far but I'm a licensed mechanic and dislike the topside oil filter. Next oil change I'll let the car sit for a couple of hours, drain the crankcase, then remove the filter cap to see if it had drained back. i have access to a friends shop so i do all my own oil changes.. Will inforn you when that happens, makes sense that you would get a noise if it has to refill the whole system.. Murray

I have put about 23,000 miles on my Entourage Limited which I took delivery of on 5/26/07 and have NEVER heard this noise when starting my van. In fact, this engine has performed flawlessly during both this past cold northern Indiana winter without any start-up noise even after sitting outside at minus 45 degree wind chills as well as no start-up noise while in Florida in late spring when temps were 90 plus with 100% humidity. I haven't used any special type of oil either, just took the car in at around 3000 miles for a oil and filter change at whatever lube place or Hyundai dealer was most convenient at the time. Also, another issue I've read about is gas mileage. I get around 21 mpg in mixed driving and just under 25 mpg for 100% highway use if I drive around the speed limit. Admittedly in stop and start all city driving it only gets about 15 mpg, but what more could be expected from a 4500 pound vehicle that hauls 7 people in pure luxury! Good luck to those having this noise problem but obviously not all of the Hyundai Entourage V-6 engines have it.

Hi Sadowner....

I haven't been on here for awhile but since we still own the Entourage I always keep an ear to the ground and an eye open on this issue.

The more that do the same the more pressure on Hyundai. Whatever the mechanical issue that exists with some of these engines, Hyundai when all is said and done will have no choice sooner or later but to provide a better explanation than it's just a built in design quirk. State AG's typically don't like getting caught in the middle between the consumer and the automaker and they will require Hyundai to come up with a better answer.

Thank you for picking up the torch and running with it.

Entour2
(Dave)

I am looking to buy a new or used Entourage next year. I appreciate knowing about this issue and will now at least start it a few times cold to check for this problem. Is this an issue with the 2008 model? will the 2009 have the same engine.

Thanks for everyone's input. :)

Did an oil change on my 3.8l, left oil pan empty for an hour then removed the filter and it had held oil. No noticeable drain back to the pan. On trying to start the engine I found a time delay that it would not fire till the oil lite went off?? Some GM's won't start till oil pressure has come up but this was a first for me with the 3.8l.