Folks, believe the reports.

The reason I'm here is because I bought an '07 Camry last fall and I'm looking to trade the POS in.

Here's the worst part. This is my 1st Toyota ever. I'm not brand loyal and I bought the Camry because I've always heard and read that Toyota meant quality. I can tell you that it the 2nd worst vehicle I've owned. The 1st was a '86 Grand Am SE; that was junk!

The Camry hasn't left me stranded on the side of the road but I've been in the dealers service department so much, the service writers joke with me about getting me a paycheck.

The car wonders at highway speeds and the dash rattles when it's cold. These issues I still have. Things that have been fixed are new tires, alignment, steering shaft clunking, and door panel replacement. I'm not even asking them to fix the fit and finish as was pointed out in the articles above.

All I can say good about the vehicle is that the fuel mileage is excellent (average 30 mpg on the highway) and I like the styling.

As I said before, I'm looking to trade it in. If the Sonata can get the same/similar fuel mileage, I'm trading. If not, I'll wait till this fall when the new '08 Accord comes out. I need the fuel mileage because I drive about 40K miles a year. I've already got 16K miles on this Camry and it's only 5 months old. Last month only put 2 miles on it due to weather. My Ram does way better in the snow.

Thanks for listening to my ranting.....

Well, the fit and finish of my 06 Sonata LX is top notch! :clap: :clap:
Unfortunately mileage is under whelming.
Recently, it hit a winter low of 9-10 mpg city/26 mpg highway.
With only 6300 miles on it, I'm hoping for improvements this summer!
:(

Take a few moments, read what the owners are saying, on Cars.com

http://research.cars.com/go/crp/research.j...e=&aff=national

It's amazing how some would swear by it, others can't wait to get RID of their new CamryLemon...

I get consistently decent milage, around 17-21 in city driving, and 29-31 on the highway.

I drive pretty aggressively, and with a heavy foot, so compared to some of the people on here, I am very pleased.

Check out a few pages back, mc229 was reporting his milage in the mid 30s!

Wow, it does seem strange that they either love it or hate it...not much middle ground...

...And, btw, you are ALL invited to add your OWN (only good, please) comments -- in the Sonata's owners' review....

See my separate thread.

I can understand why people either love it or hate it. I hate mine, but my neighbor loves his. He's has never been to the shop and mine seems like it needs to go in all the time. It's just that I don't have time to keep taking it in.

I don't know if it has to do with where it's built but my neighbors was built in Japan, while mine came from Georgetown, KY.

BTW, mine also was in the shop to correct acceleration lag. Almost got T-bones because the Camry wouldn't get out of it's own way. At 1st dealer said it was normal due to drive by wire (I called BS on that because many cars have it these days and others don't have that problem), then volia! Toyota comes out with a new program for the ECM to correct the problem. It still has lag from a dead stop, but nothing like it was before the flash.

If someone is dead set on getting a Camry, please make sure it was built in Japan. After this, I'm wondering if all the former Detriot auto workers moved to KY to build Toyota's.

Wow...sounds like the new Toyota 6 speed auto needs to go back to the drawing board. I guess it's not as simple as plugging in a couple more gears...wonder if it was rushed to market to beat competitors like GM who are actually testing their product :whistling:

Anybody know if the tranny's are built in Georgetown KY with the rest of the car? Whoever the QC person is at that plant might need to actually pay attention. It's predictable though...any time an automaker gets complacent and feels infallible (like GM and Ford did back in the 80's) then they start to lose their edge. When profitability takes precedent over making an outstanding product, people will notice.

I think I'll buy stock in the underdogs...especially GM. Their products have been pretty outstanding lately. If they keep it up, the shares should pick up in a big way. My '98 Z28 has lasted 9 years and 150k miles without a hiccup. Yes, the interior was on the cheapy side back then, but I have very few squeaks amazingly enough. We'll see if the Sonatta holds up that well. So far so good....

--That's INTERESTING... I'd think all the Camrys sold here are US-made...

But I do believe the issues with the new Camry WILL be fixed, eventually... Toyota is too big, rich and reputable to make a fool of itself....

Let's not forget that when the first Accord came out in 2003 -- it was also RIDDLED with problems, including the new Drive-by-Wire issues, but mostly, transmission issues, which have been "haunting" Honda for many years...

Almost all manufacturers repeat the mantra, "Reduced time-to-market!" Trouble is, ironing out the glitches in the design and getting the build quality right TAKE TIME!

I don't think the nationality of the people who build the car has much to do with quality. It's the management and the unions that broker unsustainable benefits ($60,000/year for a janitor?!? BTW, that's SALARY; benefits not included. Delphi) It's also management that treat their workers like ****.

There! I feel better now that I've vented.

That is why I NEVER purchase a car in it's first production year!!!

Talking about "Reduced time-to-market" --- The new Sonata was first introduced in the Paris Auto Show in 2004... And it was sold in Korea (and probably other Far-East countries) since 2004. So I must guess that Hyundai wisely decided to wait for all the glitches to show up and be corrected, before introducing the car to the American market...

And since the V6-engine car was not sold anywhere prior to its USA debut, that may explain the k-thunk issue that wasn't fix 'till only couple months ago.

It's easy to tell if a Camry is built here or in JP. The ones from JP have a little square cutout in the front bumper that's capped. I was told there's a hook of somoe type behind it and that it was used to hold the car in position while being shipped.

As for fixing the Camry..... I believe eventually they will work it out but how many of us needs to waste time and dollars taking a NEW TOYOTA into the shop?

GM lost my business back in the mid 80's by forcing me be on a 1st name bases with their dealers for warranty. I'm on a 1st name bases with with tow Toyota dealers now... I think Toyota has lost my future business too.

BTW, the best vehicles I've owned are: an '87 Mustang GT convertible and the '95 Jeep Cherokee.

The Stang was raced, wrecked, fixed over and over again. It went into the shop for 3 things, other then body work from the wrecks. The 3 things were light switch, cats and transmission. The light switch just went bad at about 50K miles. Cats, went bad at 70k miles but I got my money back because Ford eventually did a recall. The tranny need new clutch packs at 150K miles. Believe me, the tranny was my fault because of all the burnouts and racing I used to do.

The Cherokee.... I ran the devil out of it. I used it to tow my boat, drive to work, and 4 wheeled it. It's been swamped with water where myself and my passengers are sitting in it. The trannys had water in it but the thing keeps on going! These days, I only use it around the house to move trees and rocks and some 4 wheelin. The thing just keeps going and going. Oh, it went into the shop 2 times. I got the death wobble and the dealer fixed it in 15 mis. It needed a new steering stablizer. The 2nd time, I needed new axle seals because of all the mudding I used to do at the Pine Barrens in NJ. The stuff there isn't mud, but sand so I expected to chew up seals.

I can't remember where the 6 speed Auto is built but Toyota has a special program on that tranny. They say the problem with the loosing gears is due to an C-clip not being installed correctly at times.

If this happens and you contact Toyota, they will do one of the following. Replace the car with a new Camry, replace the transmission with a new tranny and give the customer a 100K Platinum bumper to bumper warranty, or give you your money back. If you choose a new Camry or replacement tranny, you also get a loaner until the process is complete.

One guy over at Toyota Nation said Toyota upgraded his Camry to a Avalon at their expense for his troubles.

I thought you could tell by the first digit of the VIN.

I know 5's are made in the US...not sure which others...

Yup you can tell by the VIN also but I don't know how to decipher Toyota's VIN. With most US built vehicles, the VIN will start with "1" for US.

Regardless of the VIN, it's easier to just look at the front bumper. You'll see the square cap on the passenger side. My buddy who is a Nissan tech tells me Nissan's are the same way with the cap on the bumper if built in Japan.

By country, the first letter/number of the VIN:

1, 2, 4 - USA/Canada/Mexico
5, 6 - Australia/New Zealand
J - Japan
K - South Korea
S - United Kingdom
W - Germany
Y - Sweden
Z - Italy

But back to topic, some of the reviews on there showed in no shortage of words how disappointed people feel in their Camrys, purported to be the best family sedan out there. Now, I wouldn't recommend one to my mortal enemies. The Honda Accord's seats absolutely kill my back so the only family sedan I would ever consider is the Sonata. :grin:

When I purchased my Sonata LX6 just over a year ago, it was after much research and "soul searching". One of my two 2003 Acura TL's was coming off lease. I have never been awed by labels and badges, having been around for some time (we are senior citizens). I bought a Toyota Corolla when they first came out and also leased my first car when the Sterling was introduced in the USA. It suffered from the English auto disease, poor quality control, but it was some car. Now I ended many years of leasing 2 cars and bought my Sonata. My wife was "exquisitely" uncomfortable in the passenger seat on any distance driving (we both have back problems). I, on the other hand, am very comfortable driving the Sonata. When it came time 8 months later to replace our 2nd leased 03 Acura TL she began asking what I was considering. I was totally non-committal which as you married guys know doesn't lend itself to a peaceful coexistence. She was adamant on not getting a Hyundai for her to drive, suffering from brand aversion as well as perceived discomfort. I tested the Camry, Avalon, TL and our friends have a Lexus and I drove that also. My dealer experience with the Sonata was the "best" and so I decided to test drive the Azera which 8 months previous I would not consider because it was a "new" model. Well after 2 weeks of "secretive" negotiations and arrangements I purchase a pearl white Azera Limited and put it in the driveway. My wife, when she saw it, uttered the disdainful words, "oh another Hyundai". I gave her the keys and told her to take it for a "spin". Instant satisfaction! It is the first car we have had in years that she doesn't find "painful to drive.
To sum up this lengthy post, I bought 2 cars, new models, from a manufacturer that had previously had the reputation of building econoboxes with short term lifespan. How things have changed. I have actually convinced a couple of our friends to go Hyundai. I can't be more pleased with my choices and the experience to date. :amen: :grin:
Don

Interesting how the uncomfortable Accord seats are mentioned again here... I have been complaining about it for a while (whenever I drive my wife's Accord with the leather seats -- after 20 minutes I start feeling uneasy and after 30 minutes I start feeling the pain...)...

And then I read somewhere else on line (don't remember where) about more Accord owners complaining about those seats....

My son has an Accord and yes indeed I have an unbearable backache after about 40 minutes of sitting in the front passenger's seat. It's an 03 with leather seats. I, personally, think that my 06 Sonata is far more comfortable and has a better ride. Of course my Azzy is even more comfortable and after driving for any extended length of time I still feel refreshed. :thumbsup:
Don