Is anyone turning their traction control off under normal dry conditions?

[JimK462]

I had my first experience with the ESC today. I will never use it again. It was snowy, and the roads were slick. I went to gently brake upon approaching an intersection and all of a sudden, it felt like I was running over concrete blocks, and had no steering. The car veered to the right and fortunately there was no one there, or I would have hit them. I had NO control over the vehicle whatsoever when this so-called "safety system" kicked in. I called my Hyundai dealer's service department and they said that this is normal? Really?? Taking away any and all control of a vehicle is a "safety" feature?? If I can figure out how to permanently disable it I will. Apparently they don't have snow in Korea, because I am a much better driver in poor road conditions than this car is when it's under the computer's control.

[Em-squared]

It is possible to turn off traction control, I do believe. Please, someone correct me if I am wrong (it's been a few months since I let go of my Elantra).

Mine scared me pretty badly the first time it happened. I took a corner too fast and it felt as if the entire car were just shutting down. Kind of scary, considering I was sort of trying to pull out fast and needed to pick up speed, not shut down!

Now, in my Leaf, this isn't the case. That thing will let me take turns too fast all day long, which is a bit scary if I've forgotten to engage the ECO mode. When it's not in ECO mode, it's got major torque, and if I take a turn too fast like that, HOLD ON.

[TurboLed]

You probably hit black ice...

[MEC-777]

I think there is a discrepancy for some people in understanding what the system is trying to do.

Typically if the vehicle is sensing it's going out of control, the least logical outcome would be to allow the car to continue going out of control and or continue traveling at a faster rate of speed. What the TCS, ESC and EBD is trying to do is correct the vehicle and regain control. Therefore if you make an aggressive maneuver which puts the car into a situation where it senses it's losing control, it's going to counter your efforts.

If you want to be aggressive with the car, potentially putting it out of control without holding back, turn the system off.

Saying the system made you loose control I think is a misunderstanding. Especially if you've never driven a car with this type of system and have never experienced what it feels like. It takes a little adaptation on the drivers behalf. Just like when ABS brakes first came out, it had to be drilled into everyone's head not to pump the brakes as you would do with non-ABS brakes. The same goes for vehicles with TCS, ESC and EBD systems.

JimK462, you must have hit ice. The ESC and EBD are specifically designed and programed to keep the car going the direction the wheels are pointed. It would never pull you into another lane like that unless it was ice, as another person suggested. On ice, not much will help anyone.

[gmcd]

Originally Posted by MEC-777

Just like when ABS brakes first came out, it had to be drilled into everyone's head not to pump the brakes as you would do with non-ABS brakes. The same goes for vehicles with TCS, ESC and EBD systems.

In the old days without ABS you at least felt like your actions would have some affect on your fate. You could pump slower, more frantically, whatever. With ABS you just hold your foot down and hope. It was hard to get used to.

I've turned the ESC (or whatever its acronym is) for deeper snow. I've just found if I'm turning a corner in deeper snow, or going up an incline, the ESC will just bog me down when I'm better off trying to power through it a bit.

Then again maybe I'm just fighting with it and don't know how to use it properly.

[Em-squared]

Originally Posted by MEC-777

I think there is a discrepancy for some people in understanding what the system is trying to do.

Typically if the vehicle is sensing it's going out of control, the least logical outcome would be to allow the car to continue going out of control and or continue traveling at a faster rate of speed. What the TCS, ESC and EBD is trying to do is correct the vehicle and regain control. Therefore if you make an aggressive maneuver which puts the car into a situation where it senses it's losing control, it's going to counter your efforts.

If you want to be aggressive with the car, potentially putting it out of control without holding back, turn the system off.

Saying the system made you loose control I think is a misunderstanding. Especially if you've never driven a car with this type of system and have never experienced what it feels like. It takes a little adaptation on the drivers behalf. Just like when ABS brakes first came out, it had to be drilled into everyone's head not to pump the brakes as you would do with non-ABS brakes. The same goes for vehicles with TCS, ESC and EBD systems.

JimK462, you must have hit ice. The ESC and EBD are specifically designed and programed to keep the car going the direction the wheels are pointed. It would never pull you into another lane like that unless it was ice, as another person suggested. On ice, not much will help anyone.

Thanks for clarifying this issue. And you're right...traction control is there to help, not to put you in another lane!

[JimK462]

Originally Posted by MEC-777

JimK462, you must have hit ice. The ESC and EBD are specifically designed and programed to keep the car going the direction the wheels are pointed. It would never pull you into another lane like that unless it was ice, as another person suggested. On ice, not much will help anyone.

Well, it wasn't ice, but it was slushy. As someone who has been driving in these conditions for nearly 40 years, I definitely wasn't being aggressive. It kicked in as soon as I gently touched the brake pedal and from that point on, I was merely a passenger until the car came to a complete halt. I will just have to remember to turn it off every time I get in the car. In my opinion, this is NOT a safe feature, unless you only drive on dry pavement or when it's above freezing. Actually I'll probably be driving this car as little as possible until Spring. I found out that even with front wheel drive it does very poorly in slick conditions, which really surprised me. All other front wheel drive vehicles I've had did great in snow and slush. The Elantra goes sideways as easily as a rear wheel drive muscle car with slicks!

[TurboLed]

Many people already complained about the poor performance of the stock tires in snow, these are low-rolling resistance so they probably become very hard in winter.
Here in Quebec snow tires are mandatory by law, and I did some test drive in a parking lot when it was snowing.
I have an Elantra GT which is probably programmed differently, for example my ESC doesn't make noise when it engages but people with the Sedan says it does a pulsating noise. But with doing a lot of circles in slippery snow with both ESC on and ESC off, I did realize the benefits of driving with ESC on.
-For example, just the Traction control (TSC) helps a lot starting from a stop sign on ice, when it's off one wheel can just go spin like crazy up to 200 km/h in the air but with TSC enabled you can push the gas pedal to the floor and the wheel is not gonna spin excessively, the engine will not over-rev and the braking effect will transfer power to the non-spinning wheel (replacing the need of a locking differential).
-Now about ESC. Turning in circles around revealed me the effects of ESC. Without ESC, I could easily oversteer, understeer. With ESC, it still happens, but you feel the help comes from somewhere else. In an understeer condition, you feel the back of the car steering as well (the back inside wheel is braking), and it can feel like losing control on the highway, and scare other drivers, because of the back end moving sideways. But what is really does is help going in the direction you want to.
-ABS cannot be disabled, and that's probably what you experienced the most during braking. It will make the brake pedal super hard and feel like it's never going to stop. Litterature does say that ABS might increase stopping distance in some conditions, but you should be able to steer with the front wheels, unless it's very slippery and the tires are crap.

[talkingrat]

I love the electronic stuff they have added. I've driven in conditions that made my Volvo's traction control kick in, and if the sensation is similar, the GT hasn't kicked in. In conditions like slush, or an oily on-ramp after first rain, the GT is balanced and on all fours. I dislike the sensation of front wheel drive in slippery conditions, I never got used to the feeling that the car is on its toes, rear end free to pivot. With the GT, all wheels are firmly planted, no slipping.

I'm used to cars with low centers of gravity, so I have taken the GT to the point where the frame leans uncomfortably to the outside on a hard turn. I didn't like the lean, but the tires stood their ground. Whatever electronic controls they put in the GT, I like them.

[JimK462]

I don't think that I've made my self clear... when this electronic control kicked in, there was NO steering, and NO brakes (well, the brakes were locked I should say). It wasn't a matter of the car trying to "adjust" and help out with the braking and steering... the car's electronics took over and tried to shut itself down. Now until Hyundai starts paying the payments, gas and insurance, then I'd just as soon have control of my own vehicle, thanks very much! :-P