Hybrid performance in minus 25C weather

[zapfogldorf]

Originally Posted by DrJim

I think you are getting good advice too but why not try and find out. The dealer wants to make a deal. Get the car cold, the dealer will probably want to warm it up for you, and take it for the round trip. Make sure to reset milage when you start and see how you do.

Please report back if you do a test, very curious.

P.S. some HSH's just seem to be better than others so test the one you intend to buy as well the Premium.

Thanks, DrJim! I've noticed that some people are having much better luck than others with the HSH. It seems that the same can be said of the Elantra. Some people absolutely love it and that's great. We just aren't getting what we wanted out of it. I'll let them know that I would like to take it for that trip and see what happens. Once I do, I'll let you know what happened. We had actually taken the car overnight a few weeks ago but after crunching the numbers realized that it wasn't as good a deal as we thought so we didn't drive it more than 20 kms. I wish I had driven it more just to see what the numbers would have been. They told me to put 100 kms on it and they filled the tank with gas for me for that test but I didn't want to put mileage on what might end up being someone else's car. About a week after we took it back we realized that we had made a mistake with our numbers and that it may have actually been a good deal so we're back trying to figure it out. Maybe they will let me take it again since that was the one that we were going to buy.

[zapfogldorf]

Originally Posted by crownr0yal

I don't think you're expecting too much. I would also not suggest getting another 2013 Elantra, as I have one and my mileage is marginally better than yours. The sticker says 28/39. If I drove purely highway, I could easily get above 40, but the city mileage is deplorable at 21-22, even when I'm babying it and getting honked at.

Thanks, crownr0yal! I think we've decided that if this doesn't work that we're just going to keep this car until we can move into something else.

I know what you mean about taking it easy on the car. I don't drive it hard at all and the reason is because I have to get as many precious kms out of it as I can each time I fill it. We bought it because we were told that we would double what we were getting in our fan and pay as much for it too. We're paying EXACTLY the same amount once a week for the same mileage. Why does that sound so terrible to me but not to the dealership!

[Rjstur]

I hate to say it but I would buy the normal Sonata. It's been -22 here in Ottawa and I have a 40 k drive and the engine never shuts off. In that drive, I have been around 9.3L/100k. I wasn't looking to buy a summer car. With such a short drive you would not like it. The car it self is very nice, and you seem to like it so again, just get the normal one. Why pay for the hybrid but get none of the benefits.

[DYKWIA]

You should consider the cost of upgrading to the HSH from the Elantra. It sounds like it would take many years to recover the cost in fuel savings based on the amount of driving you do.

[zapfogldorf]

Originally Posted by Rjstur

I hate to say it but I would buy the normal Sonata. It's been -22 here in Ottawa and I have a 40 k drive and the engine never shuts off. In that drive, I have been around 9.3L/100k. I wasn't looking to buy a summer car. With such a short drive you would not like it. The car it self is very nice, and you seem to like it so again, just get the normal one. Why pay for the hybrid but get none of the benefits.

This is a very good point. Will getting better FE in the warm weather months outweigh the extra cost? It's a great question and one that I'll have to really think about more because I'm not sure it is. The mid level Sonata is a very nice looking car as well. As much as I would like to get the HSH it just doesn't look like it will achieve what I'm looking for. And I would hate to go from something with poor FE to something else with poor FE and be on the hook for more money and more time.

[zapfogldorf]

Originally Posted by DYKWIA

You should consider the cost of upgrading to the HSH from the Elantra. It sounds like it would take many years to recover the cost in fuel savings based on the amount of driving you do.

Yes, exactly. This is something that came up in the conversation that my wife and I were having last night. If we don't make this consideration we would be foolish to just proceed.

I see that you have two Limited models. What do you think of them?

[Thunderstruck666]

I'll ask here, instead of starting a new thread-in real cold weather is it normal for the car to stay on ICE, even when engine is warmed up? This is my first real winter with the hybrid since last year was so mild. I've noticed over the last few days the car simply refuses to use the electric motor to move the car. The battery charge is far higher than I've seen, it's at 3/4 or higher. Even at that level, the car doesn't go electric although it does in summer at that SOC.

[Rjstur]

Originally Posted by Thunderstruck666

I'll ask here, instead of starting a new thread-in real cold weather is it normal for the car to stay on ICE, even when engine is warmed up? This is my first real winter with the hybrid since last year was so mild. I've noticed over the last few days the car simply refuses to use the electric motor to move the car. The battery charge is far higher than I've seen, it's at 3/4 or higher. Even at that level, the car doesn't go electric although it does in summer at that SOC.

That's just what I have been trying to say here. But it seem no body believes me. This is a summer car. JUNK JUNK in the winter. Not this 45 F stuff. I'm about to leave to go to work and the temp is -20.3 F. This blasted car has been giving me 27 mpg all winter because the ICE NEVER shuts off. I've had the bat at 95% and ICE still running every day. I keep trying to tell people/Hyundai, that it's not the ICE that needs to be warmed up but no response. In the next two weeks i'm going to fix this "summer car" problem but not sure how to tell people with out Hyundai Canada jumping on my warranty.

[Eric1r]

The car will not go into full EV mode until the ICE has reached operating temperature, especially if you have the cabin heat cranked up as it needs the hot coolant to run through the heater core. It can take up to 30 minutes at cruising speed when it's really cold outside for the ICE to reach temp.

What you will sometimes notice while cruising down the highway with a cold ICE is that the battery level will almost max out at 100% but it will not switch to full EV mode. What most people don't realize is that it does switch in and out off "hybrid" mode during this 20-30 minute warm-up period. Meaning the EV motor will work in tandem and assist the ICE while cruising at speed. If you watch your battery level you will see it sometimes decreases even though the green EV light is not illuminated. It will also do this under heavier loads (acceleration or climbing hills). This hybrid mode allows much less fuel consumption as it takes a big part of the load off from the ICE. You can't tell this is happening unless you have your center screen displaying the "Energy Flow" status. When the system switches to hybrid mode it will display energy flowing from both the ICE and battery towards the tires like below.


So just because you don't see that pretty green EV light come on it doesn't mean that the battery and electric motor aren't helping to improve your FE. It only means that the ICE isn't warm enough yet to completely shut down.

So not really JUNK JUNK in the winter, it's just misunderstood.

[Rjstur]

So what your saying is even with a block heater you shouldn't expect the ICE to be heated up in 25 miles of driving at 56mph! I know how the EV light works and that it is running in hybrid mode as your pic. Mostly people say they get almost 40mpg in the cold with shorter trips than I. HOW?! Oh yes it is much warmer than -20F The Ice never shuts off thus is always burning fuel. I have even after 10 miles shut off the heater because at 56 mph it has good air flow into cabin to be comfortable and still after the 25 miles ICE still running. So yes, JUNK JUNK. Just how long am I expected to drive before the thing is "heated up" to work properly? 30min drive? That's ok for you? Nuts. I'm not ok with that. I am kicking myself so bad for trying this, other than staying with my diesel. In this kind of weather the worst she ever gave me was 36 US mpg. Not the 25.2 and 24.4 US mpg this thing is giving me.